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juggling classes are to be free

By ATWadmin On February 28th, 2008

So Marks & Sparks have caved in to the Eco-lobby, and are planning to charge 5p for each plastic bag used by their customers, and, wait for it, donate the proceeds to an environmental charity called Groundwork. This same Groundwork has a motto stating ‘Building sustainable communities in areas of need through joint environmental action’ which just about says all about Groundwork.

 I noticed that the Northern Irish M&S have been charging for bags for some time, but always thought that this was ‘Irish-speak’ for the cash paid to the IRA to be allowed to continue in business in Northern Ireland.

The thing that troubles me is that the humble plastic shopping bag has been metaphorically seized by the chattering classes, politicians and weirdy-wobblies in the eco-environment as the opposite of the ‘Holy Grail’ in terms of environmental acceptability, but one question remains, at least to me. Have any of these clowns ever struggled to get a family’s shopping into the house or flat from the car in a typical British downpour? Shock, Horror! I use a car to do my shopping! Is there no end to the ridicule which is poured upon the likes of me? It’s not only plastic I throw away, I also splurge and throw PETROL away as well!

But there again, I will continue to use plastic bags until the Jackboot Squad comes for me, and bundle me away to the confines of a Community Centre staffed exclusively by well-meaning busy-bodies who really mean WELL!

 

28 Responses to “juggling classes are to be free”

  1. You re-use your bags Mike!! Jeez.

  2. Have any of these clowns ever struggled to get a family’s shopping into the house or flat from the car in a typical British downpour?

    "bags for life" or simple cotton bags do exactly the same job. there is nothing "loony" about ditching the plastic bag. it makes sense from both a economic, environmental and energy consumption sense (you waste oil making them). everyones a winner except old gippers like yourself who think freedom and plastic bags are inextricably linked.

  3. ‘The move comes as part of M&S’s drive, called "Plan A"’

    Was this the prelude to plan B. Ask Dr Paisley

  4. Such an ignorant comment Mike, possibly actionable by M&S.

    But feel free to stick to your outdated polluting ways, and whatever you do, don’t recycle anything. Your grandchildren will just love playing on those landfills and drinking water polluted by them.

  5. Odd posting Mike.

    Since I can remember there’s been a lurid, plastic shopping-bag permanently caught up in some overhead wires near me; signaling it’s audible presence like a forlorn machine-gunner, when the wind gets up.

    They eventually bio-degrade after about 200 years so I understand.
    May be worth a few bob by then.

  6. Mike –

    I reckon you should listen to Alison: "You re-use your bags Mike!!"

    They’re still good for suffocating greenies once the shopping’s been put away.

    Peter –

    You can have my carriers when you pry them from my cold dead hands.

  7. The bags cost 22c in Ireland but it’s a government tax. I have to say it works well in terms of reducing the number of plastic bags. You just keep durable bags in the car and use them. We’re so used to it now it doesn’t cost a thought.

  8. Pete Moore is prepared to give his life for a plastic Tesco shopping bag. Who says the age of noble sacrifice is (pardon the pun) dead !

  9. Marks & Spencers are just upping their profits by charging for carrier bags, masked under the guise of environmentalism, and that’s all there is to it.

  10. Marks & Spencers are just upping their profits by charging for carrier bags, masked under the guise of environmentalism, and that’s all there is to it.

    they are giving the profits of the venture to an environmental organisation. though it would take extraordinary naivity to think their motives are entirely altruistic.

    what i find most interesting though is the conservative reaction on here. somehow plastic bags are seen as an integral part of our culture and they should be protected. a sober reminder why you dont want people like this anywhere near public office.

    "the price of hand-held petro-chemical based transport mediums is eternal vigilence"

  11. LOL DT.

    I dunno, here comes a story that begins to supports their assertion that civil society and the almighty dollar euro can cure even environmental ills, and up pops Pete and Mike to convince any waverers that the plan they advocate is doomed and regulations are what it takes.

  12. Henry,

    "The bags cost 22c in Ireland but it’s a government tax. I have to say it works well in terms of reducing the number of plastic bags."

    I read somewhere that it was counterproductive in that it increased the amount of plastic used overall. Mind you that was possibly some libertarian die-hard clutching at straws who said that. Dunno if there is any truth to it.

  13. Frank O’Dwyer –

    That’s right, regulations are what it takes. Always regulations. I reckon you lot can’t go to the toilet without the government telling you how.

    In the meantime, maybe you or Peter or some other advocate for total state power could explain what the problem is with plastic bags. If it’s how they disfigure the public space then fine. If it’s how we use and discard them cheaply where we could re-use them, then fine.

    But all this is going on in your country, not one created by the likes of me. In my country restraint, modesty and courtesy were the informal rules of society, the parameters in which Britons were mindful of others. In my country debt and waste were frowned on, a matter of shame (yep, there’s that horrible judgementalism again.) It’s in your modern, funky, liberal Britain that we use and chuck anything thoughtlessly without regard others.

    As I keep telling you, this is your country, your culture, your society with your cheap, nihilistic values. As always, with your liberal arrogance, you cannot help pointing at others, hectoring, barking, ordering things just so. But if liberals had done the decent thing 50 years ago and committed mass suicide we wouldn’t be in this position.

  14. No we would be in Pete Moores fantasy ‘see no evil’ world which never actually existed where secrecy hypocrisy and private savagery were masked by a public face of false morality which simply refused to deal with much abuse and cruelty. God knows we have our problems today but Pete’s farcical recalling of a genteel decent world where everyone doffed their caps, were nice to each other and wouldn’t say boo to a goose is exactly the culture which allowed such activities as are being exposed in that Jersey childrens home to fester unexposed.

  15. Colm –

    My assertion is backed by the lives and recollections of millions. You cannot possibly back up the crap that you and others make up to slur better people than you.

  16. That’s OK Pete you console yourself with your rosey eyed view of the past. You continue with your total belief in the truth of the whitewashed naive recollections of the lovely lives of millions, but I will leave you for now with a little hint of what lies beneath. People who behaved abominably towards those more defenceless decades ago aren’t likely to admit it are they ?

  17. … your total belief in the truth of the whitewashed naive recollections of the lovely lives of millions …

    Of course you know better. Millions of Britons reflect on their lives with naivity, if their memories are out of step with you. Agree with Colm, or your memory displays a false conciousness.

  18. Peter, Frank O’Dwyer –

    It seems that you greenies are wrong yet again, assuming that environmental protection does motivate greenies, aside from the urge to increase state power. John Band – no reactionary he – has something to say on the matter:

    http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/02/28/plastic-bags-are-great-dont-ban-them/

    Well, plastic supermarket bags, while they make for oh-so-sad photostories of suffering seagulls, cause next to no net environmental damage. The government-funded Waste Resources Action Programme has said that because they are generally re-used as rubbish/storage bags, and because they are less environmentally costly to make than paper bags, they are the greenest current alternative.

    It gets worse. Plastic bags are of the most use to people who’re shopping on foot or by public transport; if you’re going by car you can keep your shopping in boxes, or keep a selection of Bags For Life in your boot.

    But if your shopping is done as part of a public transport commute [work -> shop -> home], which is the least environmentally damaging way to do it, then you’ve got a problem if plastic bags are banned: paper bags aren’t much use for holding things for more than the distance from checkout to car, which is why they’re popular in America, and carrying a Bag For Life wherever you go on the off-chance you might want to do some shopping at some point is hardly practical.

    If you want to impose a tax on shopping that helps the environment, then tax supermarkets £5 for every car that parks in their car parks – giving them the choice of whether or not to pass it on to the consumer, of course. If you want to drive people off public transport and into their cars, while also increasing emissions associated with bag production (but saving a couple of cute animals – so that makes it all worthwhile), then support the plastic bag tax…

    Discuss.

  19. I noticed that the Northern Irish M&S have been charging for bags for some time, but always thought that this was ‘Irish-speak’ for the cash paid to the IRA to be allowed to continue in business in Northern Ireland.

    Ive read this a few times now and I cant fathom what it means..

    Regarding the plastic bag. Cotton bags as others have suggested are a great alternative.

  20. Mike,

    You forgot to mention that M&S is run by Jews.

  21. Had the same thought Kloot. Possibly the biggest load of tripe ever posted on ATW.

  22. It is oh so simple, in France they simply announced that plastic bags in Supermarkets would no longer be provided from November 6th. End of story, no faffing, no farting just take a goddamned shopping bag with you – what make, what colour who gives a stuff. For pities sake…

  23. "I read somewhere that it was counterproductive in that it increased the amount of plastic used overall."

    Frank,

    I remember that I read something similar but then realised it was from the UK Industry Council for Packing and the Environment. Hmmm.

    Pete,

    In the Republic, large reusable cotton bags are good, large reusable cotton bags are better. Everyone uses them and it helps the environment. It’s simple. No-one thinks twice about it.

  24. Pete,

    My comment to you meant to read:

    In the Republic, large reusable PLASTIC bags are good, large reusable cotton bags are better. Everyone uses them and it helps the environment. It’s simple. No-one thinks twice about it.

  25. Maggie

    Quite. Re-use them, get cotton ones and reuse those too, buy a good strong bag and take those with you. My God we managed during WW2 to recycle and re-use and act marginally responsibly without the world falling to pieces because you had to wash out a glass bottle and take it to the coop. Or actually use bag and take it to the supermarket instead of relying on endless plastic.

    Arguing over plastic bags. With all the gumpf that goes into creating them and all the crap that litters our streets from pacakging. I mean seriously. Grow up!

  26. Getting rid of plastic bags is not eco lunacy. The things are ugly and harm wildlife. This is obvious stuff.

    It is not an affront to liberty to ban them any more than stopping people throwing the contents of their chamber pots into the streets was.

    Canvas bags are actually much more pleasent to use.

    Pete – see we have common ground!

  27. Pete Moore,

    "In the meantime, maybe you or Peter or some other advocate for total state power"

    I do not advocate total state power and nor does Peter. I can only assume that bearing false witness must rank highly among the lost British and Christian values whose passing you mourn and blame on liberals.

    As for regulations I can readily believe that 99% of them are counterproductive in one way or another. I am especially sceptical of regulations proposed by the greenies because a significant number of them are anti-scientific anti-technology new agey types (for example preferring natural aspirin to manufactured aspirin, even though they are chemically identical give or take a few bits of tree and animal waste). That doesn’t mean that some regulations aren’t necessary.

  28. Re-using the bags is a total pain. I never remember to take them with me and you end up buying more of the things, until you end up with a cupboard full.