EARTH DAY VS EDISON DAY
By ATWadmin On March 31st, 2008Just to say that I will be on the BBC Ulster “Talkback” show around 12.45pm discussing “Earth Day”, the empty stunt that the environmentalists pulled the other day, egged on by google and a few others. I take the line that those who used the occasion to celebrate “Edison Day” – the wonderful invention of the lightbulb, by Thomas Edison, got it right! The apostles for global warming love their stunts of course, remember the useless Live Earth concerts from last year? The idea that switching off lights achieves anything but publicity is facile. Publicity is what this is all about. But to be honest, if some want to live without electricity, fine. Their call. But please stop harassing the rest of us who choose to live in the light.
I also hate all the bulb-Nazis who want to force us to use these d*mnable energy-saving fluorescent bulbs. The flickering makes me ill (and the buzzing is just so irritating). I’m so glad all the environmentalists took into consideration people who suffer from things like migraines and autism before making these bulbs mandatory! (Needless to say, I’ve got ca. half a barn full of incandescent bulbs to last me the rest of my life.
)
HG,
Totally agree with you. Bulb-nazis they are!
these d*mnable energy-saving fluorescent bulbs
Says it all about Rightworld’s attitude to the environment. And please spare us the usual lip service about being in favour of a clean environment. By their deeds shall ye know them.
…by their empty stunts shall ye know them.
David,
Thanks for the heads-up on Talkback. Before Mr Burke mentioned it, I didn’t realize that standby uses about one third of live power.
I immediately turned off my TV standby and all the other wasteful units. Now my electricity bill won’t be as high as last time.
Thanks again, mate!
Peter: Says it all about Rightworld’s attitude to the environment.
I am not opposed to maintaining our environment. In fact, I have (amongst other things) a geothermal heating system in my house.
What I am opposed to is 1) being dictated to, and 2) being forced to use a light source that makes me physically ill and unable to work (which is why I used the word d*mnable).
I am not opposed to energy saving bulbs per se and look forward to the day when LED bulbs are improved to the point where they give off a proper white light (not whitish-blue) and are more readily available.
HG
I’m sure you’ll be able to buy incandesant light-bulbs for years after the rest of us have switched to energy savers.
What annoys me is the knee-jerk reaction of Rightworld against every single initiative to help the environment. Whether it’s light-bulbs, re-cycling, congestion charges or plastic bags, the chorus is always the same: RIGHTWORLD SAYS NO.
Dawkins,
No problem. Turning an un-necesaary light off is always a good idea. So is turning off stand-by. Holding stupid stunts is a waste to time. If you are still feeling generous, all you need now do is add up all that saved money and hat-tip ATW to the benefit!
‘…by their empty stunts shall ye know them.’
How about shouting over your opponent DV?
Peter,
Get used to it; it’s the Lemming Effect.
International Rightworld takes its cue from the American Neocons and Republican Party.
Here’s how it works. If the Democrats embrace an initiative then the Reps are automatically contra. Doesn’t matter if it’ll save the earth or benefit their own children and grandchildren. It’s the Dems’ initiative therefore it sucks.
Then every Rightworld denizen in all countries will follow blindly. As we see here daily on ATW.
Lemmings of the world unite!
Peter: I’m sure you’ll be able to buy incandesant light-bulbs for years after the rest of us have switched to energy savers.
Incandescent bulbs will be banned in the Rep as of Jan ’09.
Dawkins I only heard a bit of it, but DV was trying to argue a scientific argument, from what I could hear, and he isn’t qualified to do so,,, that’s dishonest.
Hibernia Girl,
You mean, they’ll go the way of the steam-powered car? :0)
Cait,
He was simply following in the footsteps of the Creationist in the earlier segment who claimed that the biblical account of the universal beginning was rational :0)
Oh, just occurred to me: that’s another of Rightworld’s hobbyhorses.
Dawkins: You mean, they’ll go the way of the steam-powered car? :0)
I wouldn’t mind giving up incandescent bulbs if there was a good, healthy alternative. (As I said, I’m looking forward to improvements in the LED bulbs.)
Unfortunately, many people (including myself) are completely incapacitated by fluorescent bulbs. The flickering causes migraines, seizures and extreme discomfort in many people (see the link I gave above). I am completely knocked out by fluorescent bulbs and have to wear dark glasses going to a supermarket, for instance, in order to protect myself.
I don’t want to have to wind up wearing sunglasses all of the time in my own home just because of all the bulb-Nazis!
The Lord Mayor of Dublin is a scientist?
HG
I run my office completely on low-energy fluorescent bulbs. None of them flicker. But the old-fashioned high-energy fluorescent ones do and those are the ones you find in supermarkets.
The stats churned out by His excellency Paddy were invented.
Peter: I run my office completely on low-energy fluorescent bulbs. None of them flicker.
CFLs "flicker" at a rate of 20,000 Hz — much more rapidly than the old fluorescent bulbs, but they still flicker. Most people may not notice the flicker, but some of us do — and are made ill by it.
Peter,
That is your choice. Others want the choice to do otherwise. Why are we to be denied it?
I won’t be able to use them, one of my family has severe epilepsy.
I don’t think the terms leftworld and rightworld are helpful. I have been accused of belonging to both on ATW but like most people my views are more mixed than that.
Neither rightworld nor leftworld but best of all possible worlds.
The Green Party are a small part of the coalition government in Ireland. They could do some useful things like breaking up the state monopoly on the bus service. But they don’t have the political bottle for that so they concentrate on pointless tokenism.
The EU are bringing in the bulb change anyway. We are just doing it earlier.
David,
The correct form of address is the Right Honourable Lord Mayor. If you can’t even get that right why should we believe your "science"?
Henry, I’d better stock up on candles.
Henry,
Neither rightworld nor leftworld but best of all possible worlds.
From now on, I shall call you Pangloss.
[Note: The above is meant to be taken Candidely.]
David
Would you be in favour of bringing back leaded petrol in the name of free choice? Or removing the requirement for car exhausts to have catalytic converters?
Heh:
Google celebrates Israel’s "Earth Hour" by consuming more energy for 60 minutes
Also, from Mark Steyn:
"Another attractive feature of ‘Earth Hour’ is the opportunity it offers to transform free nations into a society of eco-Stasi:
"Between 8 and 9 tonight, I’ll be doing what I usually do at that time:I’ll be out with my wife walking our two dogs 5km around our small town.
"Tonight, however, I’ll be looking at my neighbours’ windows to see which ones are participating in Earth Hour."
"Eco-stasi"
You’ve got to hand it to Rightworld. They do make up good names to call their opponents. Gloriously over the top as usual.
"Tonight, however, I’ll be looking at my neighbours’ windows to see which ones are participating in Earth Hour."
I think that explains a lot of the knee-jerk reaction. The environmentalists come across as the same old busybodies with a new reason for interfering in peoples lives.
Given rightworld’s deep and abiding interest in other people’s private moral decisions, calling other people stasi is surely April 1st come early.
No, what this illustrates that is if the case for mitigation is made, then it isn’t enough to just ignore our friends who live along the banks of that river in egypt (dee Nile). They can’t be relied on to act voluntarily either. Just more data in support of regulations and putting a price on carbon.
Peter
"What annoys me is the knee-jerk reaction of Rightworld against every single initiative to help the environment"
It’s not "Rightworld" at all. Why is it "right wing" because the idea is defined on ATW? In fact who are "Rightworld". ATW aren’t Conservatives, true conservatives at any rate, or libertarians. ATW is not really defin-able in the right wing sense. It is not in favour of true personal liberty for a start, because it would dictate to others on issues IT feels are prescient. So im not sure you can say "rightworld" are opposed to energy saving money saving ideas per se – if by that you mean anyone right wing.
Peter,
Hah, I thought my allusion to the steam-powered car was miles better! Ten miles farther on a litre of water than on a litre of unleaded.
Alison
Since when was Mark Steyn a leftie?
David: One of the areas conservatives could improve in is a knee-jerk reaction against any environmental (dare I say it?) conservatism. While there are indeed those on the left who go overboard, there are real issues and real problems with the enivronment that need to be addressed.
ATW is not right or left – it is simply trying to express opinions which tend to be right of liberal, although that depends what you call liberal. Todays liberal lot – like the Nick Cleggs of this world – are not really liberals in the traditional sense of the word. They IMPOSE, they BAN, they LIMIT. I don’t think any of that is liberal in the sense the word once had? Do you?
David,
If that’s the case, care to list at least two of your opinions on the world, religion, politics etc, that differ from the opinions held by rightwing America?
David: I agree that much of what passes for liberal may in fact be at odds with the original word’s intent. As for ATW, aside from a remarkable affection for rock music, I am unaware of liberal tendancies of any of its writers (your humble author excluded). Be that as it may, I still think conservatives would have more respect on environmental issues if they were always so gungho against any environmental recommendations.
Peter
Since when did he define the Right? Seriously. Who cares what that jerk thinks? Mark Steyn is a hero to some. Especially in the US and to some here because he says absurd things like ..the UK totally sucks ..and people strangely like that. They think that helps.
?.
I vote right. I cannot stand him. Just a joyless man who writes with the dollar aimed panache of Coulter eg with nothing of any substance.
I am not opposed to any efforts to protect the environment – and that most definitely includes no brainers like energy saving bulbs!
Alison
I appreciate your point and I share your contempt for Coulter in particular.
But I think it’s fair to say that the right, at least in the USA, defines the environmental movement as left-wing and therefore tends to automatically oppose all efforts to improve the environment. This is less obvious in Britain, where there is more of (dare I say it) a consensus between the political parties on green issues.
Peter
Yeah and you do have a point also – partic. about the US Right and Green. Weird how that has happened.
One thing i never understand is why any on the Right can claim to be for reducing our reliance on the ME on the one hand and then want to ramp up the use of all the things that keep us hooked to them. Key to reducing terrorism is to royally give them the finger. Specifically with petrol $.
Generally I’m very much in favour of all measures to reduce our dependence on them even if it means forcing the measures through. And obviously man affects the environment – to say it doesn’t is insanely blind.
Plus from a religious perspective, cough cough, why would you want to actively set about being destructive of the planet just to avenge a politician!
Alison: I am not opposed to any efforts to protect the environment – and that most definitely includes no brainers like energy saving bulbs!
I’m (obviously) conservative about many (but not all) issues — and I’m very happy to do stuff that protects the environment. Thinking long-term — I’d like to conserve our wonderful planet for our descendants (although I don’t buy into the Global Warming religion — might be, might not be — jury’s still out as far as I am concerned).
However, the problem with "no brainer" energy saving light bulbs is that they make some people (including me) seriously ill — and the bans on incandescent bulbs are going to leave some of us in agony. The whole CFL thing has been a horrible example of tyranny of the majority — most "eco-friendly" people have not wanted to hear about the problems CFLs cause — they just wanted to impose these dreaded bulbs on EVERYone without giving anyone an option to opt out. I know — I’ve been trying to talk sense about these bulbs to such people for a looong time.
Why we couldn’t have all just waited a couple of years for LED bulbs that save even more energy I’ll never understand.
HG
Fair point.
The ‘energy-saving’ bulbs: are they not a wee bit dangerous if they break? How to clean up when one breaks – please advise.
Peter: Conservatives – a subset, I believe of what you call "Rightworld" – are against Mandated Big Government solutions. COnservatives are NOT against conserving, protecting, responsibility for environement.
The manmade global warming movement is felt by Conservatives to be a political ploy to institute more Big Government control over individuals.
It is felt that mandated Big Government solutions generally causes more problems then they solve due to the nature of Big Government, while curtailing free market solutions and individual freedoms.
Allan
You will be relieved to hear that I broke one last week and survived.
Patty
"Mandated big government solutions" may not be ideal but they are better than no solution at all. Do you think the car-makers would have reduced car pollution (to the extent that they have) without state regulation? My individual freedom to breathe clean air has been enhanced, not diminished, by state action.
Patty,
"Conservatives – a subset, I believe of what you call "Rightworld" – are against Mandated Big Government solutions. COnservatives are NOT against conserving, protecting, responsibility for environement.
Just against every proposal for doing anything about it?
The manmade global warming movement is felt by Conservatives to be a political ploy to institute more Big Government control over individuals."
MMGW is not a movement it is a theory supported by evidence.
Also, you have got your venn diagram wrong there. Rightworld is the one with the conspiracy theory, and Rightworld is a subset of conservative.
Replace ID with ‘rightworld’ and it’s pretty much this.
Interesting, I guess I’ve learned something today – I never knew that low-energy domestic bulbs triggered health problems in some people.
I’m even more astounded that some people can see light-flicker at 20,000Hz. CRT PC monitors at 60Hz I find very irritating indeed (odd, that, because I’m not bothered by TVs, which run at 50Hz) , but at 85Hz I can’t see PC monitor-flicker.
Off-topic late-night thought strikes me – if you put two light bulbs together and their flicker is out of phase, would there be no light?
Tom,
Far as I’m aware, it’s been the practice for a long time to place two fluorescent bulbs side by side, thereby neutralizing each individual bulb’s flicker.
Tom,
The flicker is not the power of the light source persay, it is the oscillation of the excitation charge which acts on the gas plasma that then emits the photons (light). therefore two sources would merely emit photons with miniscule a time difference between them. it is not phase in the same sense as electricity (which is power related), it is merely time. HG is exposed to extremely rapid cycles of light and no light. the flicker is not sinusoudal, although the charge oscillation is.
its quantum mechanics in action. as the electons in the plasma get excited (and relaxed) by the charge (and lack of charge) they emit photons for each quantum movement they make. choose the right gas and the right charge level and majority of photon emmission will be at your desired bandwidth/wavelength of light. welcome to the whacky world of sub-atomic physics.
i think thats right, or at the very least thats what my shoddy memeory has told me.
Allan
You will be relieved to hear that I broke one last week and survived.
Monday, March 31, 2008 at 10:09PM | Peter
That’s a bit flippant is it not, Peter? Mercury vapour is highly toxic and damages the brain and nervous system. But because the low energy bulbs are supposedly countering MMGW, then what’s a bit of mercury exposure to an environmentalist?