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a chance for the difference

By Mike Cunningham On April 15th, 2015

I have looked at, but not yet studied in depth, the UKIP Manifesto. (click on the download file)

But even if I had not read a single word, I would vote for them because they are not Labour, or Tory, or LibDem.

 

67 Responses to “a chance for the difference”

  1. Powerful messaging from team UKIP Mike. The manifesto sets out some potent libertarian ideas for Britain. Democracy is starting to be reinforced by all of their cumulative efforts in the UK and Europe. Exciting stuff!Create an earthquake!

  2. UKIP recognises the need for the country to have adequate armed forces. With Russian “Bears” flying close to the country and naval ships passing down the English channel we need to expand, not run down the military. The nearest Tornado to the English Channel was based at Lossimouth!
    Perhaps Russia is on UKIP’s side! The Russian action has at least put the military into the news for a short while.

  3. UKIP recognises the need for the country to have adequate armed forces. With Russian “Bears” flying close to the country and naval ships passing down the English channel we need to expand, not run down the military

    Won’t that take extra tax ££’s? Where will that come from?

  4. At the point of a gun the tax will be extracted.

    It will be a new ” tyranny “

  5. Won’t that take extra tax ££’s? Where will that come from?

    £11 billion from ‘foreign aid’ just for starters.

  6. No, if even one pound and 50 pence is collected in tax, you are a tyranny worse than any in history.

    I heard this from somewheres.

  7. That just leaves 28 bn £ pa to make up then Harri.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/generalelection/ukip-economic-policy-spend-38bn-every-year-on-defence-but-leave-the-eu-axe-foreign-aid-scrap-hs2-and-cut-scottish-spending-10127966.html

  8. £45 million a day to the EU.

  9. Scr

  10. Scrap HS2

    £2 billion

  11. HS2?

  12. Scrap HS2

    Roger that. Paul, it’s the barrel of pork known as a high speed railway line from London to Birmingham and then “the North” bring untold riches in its wake. For the contractors and their Polish staff of course.

  13. Alright, let’s say all these changes are implemented, where does the remaining deficit come from?

  14. £45M a day?

    So £16.4B a year.

    Where do you come up with these figures?

  15. Are those numbers net contributions or do they include offsets of whatever the UK gets back from the EU?

  16. http://www.brugesgroup.com/CostOfTheEU2008.pdf

  17. We need a bonfire.

    The cost of quango Britain hits £170bn – a seven-fold rise since Labour came to power
    By IAN DRURY FOR THE DAILY MAIL
    UPDATED: 23:55, 16 September 2009

    The cost of unaccountable taxpayer-funded quangos has hit a staggering £170billion.
    An analysis of almost 1,000 ‘arm’s length’ Government bodies reveals they are swallowing up seven times more money than a decade ago.
    They cost only £24.1billion in 1997/8 – the year Labour came to power after promising a ‘bonfire of the quangos’.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1214001/The-cost-quango-Britain-hits-170bn–seven-fold-rise-Labour-came-power.html#ixzz3XPVLkcdP
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

  18. You expect the bn£ deficit to come from a six year old DM article Harri?

  19. BTW Harri, who was it said that

    ‘Election manifestos are not legally binding and are not worth the paper they’re written on?’

  20. ‘Election manifestos are not legally binding and are not worth the paper they’re written on?’

    Who ever it was, was having a rare moment of political honesty

  21. Paul McMahon, on April 15th, 2015 at 9:13 PM Said:
    BTW Harri, who was it said that
    ‘Election manifestos are not legally binding and are not worth the paper they’re written on?’

    I did 😉

    I got that advice from Gordon Brown.

  22. Paul McMahon, on April 15th, 2015 at 9:09 PM Said:
    You expect the bn£ deficit to come from a six year old DM article Harri?

    You are right,I now expect that figure to be a lot higher.

    We can start with all the non-jobs and NHS managers next.

    And then the council ‘directors’

  23. It’s like groundhog day, Cameron promised a bonfire of the quangos too.

    They increased.

    We don’t need them.

  24. Sorry this took so long. The link you sent was long and full of bullshit.

    The bit about the indirect cost that the CAP and Fisheries policy has for consumers is flawed. It states that European consumers are paying 23% more for agriculture products than you would get on the international market. It is based on the assumption that if Britain was to leave the EU then Britain would buy no agriculture products from the EU. It is farcical.

    Similarly the 70% figure of all fishing being caught by the EU being British is taking from the fact that 70% of the EU’s fishing is done in the North Eastern Atlantic. UKIP have apparently annexed the Republic of Ireland again. Truth be told UK territorial waters only account for about 50% of the EU’s North Eastern Atlantic fishing area. And that would collapse to a minuscule amount if, for example, Scotland was to leave the UK with the bulk of the UK’s territorial water actually being Scotland’s territorial water.

    Similarly the over regulation bit is bollocks. Firstly the 84% of regulation being from the EU has been shown to be incorrect. It is based on a statement made by a German civil servant where he stated that the EU had passed 18,937 laws, while Germany had passed in the same period of time 3,500 laws. Firstly Germany is a federal system, where individual Lander has substantial powers to legislate autonomously. The many laws adopted on the Lander-level would have to be included in any all laws count, which isn’t the case here. In addition, this count says nothing about the nature of the laws. Some laws are more important. One cannot compare Germany to Britain as the two have very different set ups. However a study by the House of Commons showed that the proportion of laws that came from Europe as actually 9.1%, and a later study by German academics showed that it is about 15.5%.

    Additionally UKIP’s premise is based on the idea that if the UK was not in the EU that they would not have those regulations. The three examples given are working-time regulations, car-tax regulations, and data protection. Three things UKIP would have you believe that would not occur if Britain was not in the EU, and are thus costing the UK money. UKIP states that any regulation that does not have a direct economic benefit would not be passed in the UK (so there goes most regulation – and probably the environment and workers rights).

  25. OK Harri.

    Which quangos will you get rid of. Lets have a list.

  26. We can start with all the non-jobs and NHS managers next.
    And then the council ‘directors’

    Is that UKIP policy or did you come up with that one yourself?

    Do you have monetary figures of how much this would allegedly save?

    BTW Harri, who was it said that

    ‘Election manifestos are not legally binding and are not worth the paper they’re written on?’
    I did 🙂

    So do you believe UKIP then?

  27. We can start with all the non-jobs and NHS managers next.

    What would you do with the NHS managers?

    Fire them all?

    That’ll work.

  28. I will imagine that some of the managers are overpaid and that some are useless.

    But some are seriously good have hard to replicate skills.

    I have said before. An Irish pal of mine is married to one of these evil ” managers “. This family moved from England ( which they totally liked living in ) in favor of Bermuda ( not a bad place ) and one of the reasons is that she as a hospital administrator doubled her salary as an NHS manager with an equivalent job at a Bermuda hospital, and and Bermuda doesn’t have any income tax while the UK surely does have one.

    There are some good managers in the NHS, and if you don’t want them, other countries will want the good ones yes they will.

    Medici

  29. Phantom, UKIP’s policy in a nutshell is get rid of Johnny Foreigner, get out of the EU and everything will fall int place because God will smile on Britain.

    If and when UKIP ever come to power given a few years the same people here will be complaining about the same things with the only difference being there’ll be less of Johnny Foreigner to use as a scapegoat

  30. I am not unsympathetic to the Brits who would like to get out of the EU. Maybe it never should have entered it in the first place, and maybe the expanded European state is/was an insane idea.

    I have never understood why a -big- country like the UK could not have worked out a friendly trade and other matters cooperation agreement with neighbors without moving to a federal state.

    But man this train is way down the tracks now amigo.

  31. I am not a particular fan of the EU but the UK will remain in the EU for many years and decades.

  32. If you tale trade completely off the table – in an era where trade is freer than at any time in modern history, you should do so – how does the UK benefit otherwise from being a member of the EU?

    If we could turn back the clock to say 1970, would any British people choose to enter the EU?

    Because IMO they absolutely could have cut a free trade deal with Europe, since global trade is so free now anyway, while not paying anything into the Beast, agriculture, any of it.

  33. bottom line if you put it to a vote the people would vote to leave the EU.

    It is those who believe they are the common mans betters that refuse to allow you the opportunity to express your choice one way or another. They don’t trust the peasants to stick to their plans for you.

  34. // how does the UK benefit otherwise from being a member of the EU?
    If we could turn back the clock to say 1970, would any British people choose to enter the EU? //

    Well, they did!

    No, Petr, is right here. By the look of things at the moment, the UK is set to stay in the EU for the foreseeable future. There is probably already a majority in favour of continued membership, or at least more want to stay in than want to get out. And that’s even before a referendum campaign started: once all the major parties and trade and civic organisations weigh in, but above all once Britain’s business world starts campaigning strongly for the EU, the numbers in favour of staying in will increase even further.

    It’s impossible to know how Britain would have fared if it had never joined. But the creation of a single market of 500 million people has had a very positive impact on economies and standards of living all over the continent. It brings investment to Britain and has helped make the UK such a top global financial centre. The EU has also signed free trade deals with around a third of the countries in the world, which gives the UK automatic access to export markets worth trillions of dollars. EU policy seems now to be focussed on accessing further developed and emerging markets that will, we are told, as much as double the present export figures.

    All of this could of course change if the world or EU economy shows a marked downturn, but the way things stand now British people overall see the benefits of membership, and this support is more likely to grow when the current recovery is consolidated.

  35. The Troll, on April 16th, 2015 at 1:38 AM Said:

    bottom line if you put it to a vote the people would vote to leave the EU.

    There is only one way to find out.

  36. So do you believe UKIP then?

    Only by a hairs breath more than I do the other bunch of pathological liars.

  37. Do you have monetary figures of how much this would allegedly save?

    No NHS Chief executive should be earning over a quarter of a million pounds a year.

    It’s obscene.

    How many nurses or new abumlances could the NHS buy with £23,000,000?

    NHS spends £23m a year on translators

    The NHS spends £64,000 a day on translation services, a report has found.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/9063200/NHS-spends-23m-a-year-on-translators.html

  38. Ambulances .. even.

  39. Seamus, on April 15th, 2015 at 9:50 PM Said:

    OK Harri.

    Which quangos will you get rid of. Lets have a list

    .

    All of them.

  40. Seamus, on April 15th, 2015 at 9:50 PM Said:

    OK Harri.

    Which quangos will you get rid of. Lets have a list

    And that includes, all Common Purpose as well.

  41. Read it and weep.

    The Bumper Book of Government Waste: The scandal of the squandered billions from Lord Irvine’s wallpaper to EU saunas

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Bumper-Book-Government-Waste/dp/1897597797

  42. ‘Useless’ Public Sector Projects Cost UK £120bn

    Taxpayers’ money is wasted on motivational magicians, decorating skips and council clothing allowances, a report finds.

    http://news.sky.com/story/1103956/useless-public-sector-projects-cost-uk-120bn

    Wail, wail .. “Where is the money going to come from”

    It’s really not rocket science, why make it so?

  43. 20 Disgusting Wasteful Examples of Spending by the UK Government

    1. £26bn Wasted on Computer Blunders. In January it was reported that The Independent had investigated Labour’s 10 most well-known IT mistakes and found that these mistakes cost taxpayers over £26bn in wasted funds. The biggest waste was a £12.7bn plan for the NHS to start using new electronic records. Fewer than 200 out of 9,000 health organizations are using the technology despite the fact that the money was spent on it. Delayed, canceled and faulty computer plans throughout the government continue to waste your money to this day.

    2. £76bn Wasted on Trident Nuclear Missile System. Back in 2006, the government managed to sell the idea of the Trident Nuclear Missile System by citing a cost of less than £25bn. However, this cost didn’t take into consideration the long-term costs of maintaining the equipment once it was in place. The real cost for this program ended up at more than three times the initial projections. The real problem here was that the government forged ahead with the plan without actually allowing a debate to take place that might have allowed for conversation that would have resulted in a smarter spending decision.

    3. £18bn Wasted on ID Cards that You Don’t Even Want. In 2005, the government wanted to institute a biometric passport system that would require people to get new IDs and would also require new ID equipment to be purchased. The government estimated the cost of the IDs to be approximately £93 per person and the cost of the equipment to be about £5.8bn in total. The true costs turned out to be about 3 times that at £300 per person and between £12bn and £18bn for the equipment. Last year the government upgradedthe passport system in a £265 million contract with IBM

    4. £5bn Wasted by Bad Gold Sale. The government’s blunders haven’t just been committed recently. If we look back to the period of time between 1992-2002 we can see that the government at that time managed to waste £5 bn simply by choosing to sell its gold at the wrong time. The treasury sold gold from the UK gold reserves at a time when the price was fairly low. The price climbed steadily after that but it was too late since the gold was already gone. You would think simple financial deals like this would be par for the course with the government but it’s clearly something that they can do wrong.

    5. £17bn Wasted on Unnecessary High Speed Rail Link. Admittedly £17bn isn’t a lot of money to spend on advanced transportation like a high speed rail. However, it’s a big waste when the whole thing is going to only end up saving commuters about 20 minutes on the trip between Birmingham and London. Add in the fact that low-cost spending on existing rail lines would be much more cost-effective and the fact that the new proposed high speed rail might do some serious damage to the local countryside and you’ve got to start wondering why the government wants to spend so much money on this project!

    6. £50m Wasted on Assets Recovery Agency. Here’s some bad math for you … Back in 2007, the government set up an agency to recover assets from criminal thieves. During its operation, the agency was able to recover approximately £8mn worth of assets. However, the cost to operate the agency during that time was £60mn. In other words, you paid a fortune in taxes to set up an agency that couldn’t even break even by doing its job.

    7. £57m Wasted on Benefits for Dead People. In 2006 alone the government managed to make the appalling mistake of paying out £57m in benefits to people who weren’t actually alive to receive those benefits. The problem in nearly all of these cases was that the payments were set up to pay out automatically and the person died after the payment was already processed to be sent. The majority of the payments were made to pensioners who passed away but a significant amount was payment for income support to people who died while they were being supported. Did you even know that your income was going to pay the income of dead people?

    8. £2.6bn Wasted on Benefit Fraud and Errors. If you thought it was bad that so much money was being wasted giving benefits to dead people then you might be even more upset to find out that about five times more than that was wasted on benefits that went to people who didn’t deserve them. Also in 2006 there was £2.6bn spent on benefits that were either fraudulent or were miscalculated due to simple errors. That’s a lot of waste happening for pretty much no reason at all. Do you think that they’ve learned their lesson since then? No, in fact, they’ve gotten worse. The Tax Payers Alliance reports that the most recent benefits waste due to fraud and errors was about £3.2bn.

    9. £2.5m Wasted on Translators Paid to Do Nothing. Two women were paid £25,000 each per year for 15 years to basically do nothing. They had translating jobs that were given to freelancers but they were never reassigned to new work and essentially just collected a paycheck for showing up. You would think this would be something to be happy about but instead they complained about the fact that the government forgot about them. Long story short there was a lawsuit with claims of race discrimination and the end result was a waste of £2.5mn in salaries and legal fees for these ladies.

    10. £600,000 Wasted on Lost Phones. What would you do if you lost your mobile phone? You would probably call your carrier and cancel your service so that you wouldn’t be charged if someone picked up the phone and used it right? The government apparently doesn’t have that kind of common sense, though. Back in 2003 the government sent 10 phones to Iraq but never confirmed where they ended up. A year and a half later they realized that two of the phones had been stolen and were used to rack up £600,000 in phone bills. Yes, it was your money that paid that bill.

    11. £800m Wasted to Help People “Feel European”. There is an EU programme in place that is designed to help people aged 13-30 “feel more European”. This is done through events and classes that teach things like traidtional folk dancing and basket weaving. Hidden in the £800mn expense is a portion of money that is used by the children of government officials for the purpose of sending them on ski trips. In a time when the global economy is shaky at best, how can an expense like this be justified to taxpayers?

    12. £1bn Wasted on Perk Credit Cards. Last year UK government officials managed to spend £1bn on their government procurement credit cards. Sure, some of this spending might have been for things that were actually needed. However it’s been shown that a lot of that spending was on frivolous stuff like super-expensive lunches. The average person knows that spending on credit cards should always be a last resort. And the problem is particularly bad since there are so many people in the public sector who expect to be laid off because the government supposedly can’t afford to keep them on.

    13. £240m Wasted on Fire Control Centres. In another infamous example of bad spending projections, the government said back in 2004 that they needed £72mn to set up a network of fire control centres that would increase safety in the area. The main purpose was to get the area truly safe for the 2012 Olympics. However, the centres are not complete and may not be up and running before the Olympics happen. Plus the cost has now more than tripled to a projected £240mn. This includes a massive £40,000 day spent PER DAY on headquarters that are being rented but sit empty.

    14. £3m Wasted on Legal Aid to Criminal Politicians. Three Labour politicians have recently been accused of stealing £60,000. That’s not good. But what’s even less good is the fact that they aren’t hiring their own lawyers but instead are getting legal aid. It is expected that the total cost to taxpayers for their ongoing legal fees could be as much as £3mn.

    15. £4m Wasted on Untested Alternative Medicine. The NHS has been wasting your money by giving out alternative medicine that is controversial. Many people are saying that the £4mn spent recently on homeopathic cures was essentially like spending that much money on candy for patients since it did them about as much good as the candy might have. The case for this spending has supporters on both sides but it’s definitely questionable in a time when prudent spending would be smartest.

    16. Millions of Pounds Wasted on Motorcycle Test Centres. A new Europe-wide motorcycle exam is required now. However it’s only in the UK that the government deemed it necessary to open 66 new testing centres for the exam. The old testing centers for other vehicles could have been used or upgraded at a much smaller cost to taxpayers. It’s not clear at this time how much money was wasted on the project but it’s apparently in the millions of pounds.

    17. £2.4m Wasted on Website When a Free Alternative Could Have Been Used. The UK government spent £2.4mn to build a website that offers cycling route information to people in the area. This is a great idea for a website but it wasn’t necessary to spend that much money. That’s because there’s already a website with this information which is far more accurate and comprehensive than the government website. The government could have simply linked to this existing website instead of spending your money to build their own inadequate version.

    18. £650m Per Year Wasted Because of Refusal to Recycle. It isn’t just the people who care about the Earth who want the UK government to start doing more recycling. It’s also the people who care about where their money goes. One report indicates that the government is wasting £650mn per year on dumping and incinerating trash that could be recycled at a much lower cost.

    19. £2.4m Wasted on Police PR. The police apparently want to look good in the media and the cost is coming straight out of your bank account. A recent report shows that 4 West Midlands police officers managed to waste £2.4m on media relations, a 75% increase in spending for their normal budget. They say it’s worth it because the press releases help to catch criminals but whether or not that is true is a bit questionable.

    20. £50bn Wasted Per Year Because the Government Won’t Cut Back Where it Can. Finally, research from the Tax Payers Alliance shows that the government is currently wasting approximately £50bn per year on things that they could cut back on but just don’t bother. Expenses include spending £6.5bn per year on the Department of Trade and Industry which seems to do little if nothing in its government role, spending £1.7bn too much per year on sick calls by public sector workers and spending £1.7bn per year on failed Ministry of Defence projects.

  44. Another easy couple of million+ savings to be had .. all easy stuff.

    Sir David Nicholson quits: NHS chief awarded £1.9m pension pot

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/sir-david-nicholson-quits-nhs-chief-awarded-19m-pension-pot-8626976.html

  45. Named: the highest NHS fat cat earners

    An investigation by The Sunday Telegraph has uncovered at least 660 NHS managers who earn more than the Prime Minister.

    Below, the list of those earning £200,000 and more:

    THE HIGHEST EARNERS *

    1. David Bennett £282,500

    Was interim chief executive of Monitor, independent regulator of NHS foundation trusts, from March 2010 to February 2011

    2. Neil Lloyd £282,500

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    Sponsored by Property Crowd

    Chief executive, NHS Professionals

    3. Ruth Carnall £277,500

    Chief executive, London Strategic Health Authority

    4. Sir Ron Kerr £274,500

    Chief executive, Guy’s and St Thomas’s NHS Foundation Trust

    5. Sir Robert Naylor £262,500

    Chief executive, University College London Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust

    6. Peter Morris £262, 000

    Chief executive, Barts and The London trust

    7. Clare Chapman £252,500

    Director general of workforce, Department of Health

    8. Sir Andrew Cash £243,100

    Chief executive, Sheffield Teaching Hospitals Foundation Trust

    9. Dr Mark Goldman £242, 500

    Chief executive, Heart of England Foundation Trust until July 2010

    10. David Dalton £232 600

    Chief executive, Salford Royal NHS Foundation trust

    11. Sir Neil mckay £232, 500

    Chief executive, East of England

    12 Sir Leonard Fenwick £232 500

    Chief executive, The Newcastle upon Tyne Hospitals Trust

    13. Dame Barbara Hakin, £227,500

    Chief executive, East Midlands strategic health authority

    14. Tim Smart £227 500

    Chief executive, Kings College Hospital Foundation Trust

    15. Ken Bremner £225 000

    Chief executive, City Hospitals Sunderland Foundation Trust

    16 Alan Foster, £223 400

    Chief executive, North Tees and Hartlepool foundation trust

    17. Maggie Boyle

    Chief executive, The Leeds Teaching Hospitals trust 222 500

    18. Robert Dolan, £220 000

    Chief executive, East London Foundation Trust

    19. Dr Gareth Goodier £217 500

    Chief executive, Cambridge University Hospitals Foundation trust

    20. Prof Ann Sheen £217 500

    Chief executive, Royal Berkshire Foundation Trust (until March 2010)

    21. Cally Palmer £217 500

    Chief executive, Royal Marsden Foundation trust

    22. Sir Ian carruthers £217,500,

    Chief executive, South West Strategic Health Authority

    23. Malcolm Stamp £217 500

    Chief executive, University Hospitals Coventry and Warwickshire

    24. Dr Frank Harsent £213 800

    Chief executive, Gloucestershire Hospitals Foundation Trust

    25. Mike Deegan £212 500

    Chief executive, Central Manchester University Hospitals Foundation trust

    26. Paul Baumann £212,500

    Director of finance, London strategic health authority

    27. Justin McCracken £212,500

    Chief executive, Health Protection Agency

    28.Julie Moore, £212 500

    Chief executive University Hospitals Birmingham Foundation Trust

    29. Sir David Nicholson £212,500

    NHS chief executive

    30. Malcolm Lowe-Lauri £212,500

    Chief executive, University Hospitals of Leicester trust

    31. Jim Mackey, £212 700

    Chief executive, Northumbria Healthcare Foundation trust

    32. Mike Cooke £210 600

    Chief executive, Nottinghamshire healthcare trust

    33. Caroline Shaw, £207 500

    Chief executive, Christie Foundation trust

    34. Prof Sir Liam Donaldson £207,500

    Chief Medical Officer for England until May 2010

    35. Dr Peter Lees, £207,500

    Medical Director and Director of Leadership, NHS South Central

    36. Simon Pleydell, £205 000

    Chief executive, South Tees Hospitals Foundation trust

    37. Anthony Marsh, £203 150

    Chief executive, West midlands ambulance trust

    38. Cynthia Bower £203,500

    Chief executive, Care Quality Commision

    39. Stephen Eames £202 700

    Chief executive, County Durham and Darlington NHS Foundation Trust

    40. Christine Connolly £202,500

    Chief information officer for health, Department of Health

    41. Mike Farrar £202,500

    Chief executive, NHS North West Strategic Health Authority

    42. Rob Clarke £202,500

    Finance director, NHS Professionals

    43. Glenn Douglas £200 200

    Chief executive, Maidstone and Tunbridge Wells trust

    44. Nick Moberly £200 000

    Chief executive Royal surrey County Hospital Foundation trust

    45. Mark Hackett, £200 000

    Chief executive, Southampton University Hospitals trust

    46. Dr Patrick Geoghegan £200 000

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/8485539/Named-the-highest-NHS-fat-cat-earners.html

  46. Stop invading other countries .. we can’t afford it.

    The cost of Britain’s interventions in Iraq and Afghanistan has reached almost £30bn

    ‘Costly failures’: Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan cost UK taxpayers £30bn

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/costly-failures-wars-in-iraq-and-afghanistan-cost-uk-taxpayers-30bn-9442640.html

    The cost to taxpayers for ‘Global warming’

    Britain has pledged even MORE money to fight climate change in the Third World … is still running at £100 billion a year

    http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/537903/Global-warming-waste-money-climate-change-aid-Third-World

    Stop all this shit, we can’t afford it.

    Are we back in the black yet?

    No rocket science required.

  47. Harri’s in-between building a greenhouse manifesto ..

    It’s just so easy, I am basing most of this on ‘We are all in this together’ mantra.

    Only for real.

    Here is another £500,000 saved, every penny counts.

    In fact sack all the ‘crime tsars’ with immediate effect.

    Countless millions more saved.

  48. Legalise all drugs.

    Another £100 billion saved over 10 years.

    We must be near paying off the national debt by now.

    Charity says illegal drug users cost taxpayers £16bn last year – but only £3bn was spent tackling addiction

    Last updated at 21:39 24 February 2008

    Illegal drug use cost Britain an estimated £110billion over the past decade – and more than £16billion last year alone, research revealed yesterday.

    But only £3billion of the total has gone on actually tackling addiction, according to drug and alcohol charity Addaction.

    Its report was published only days before the Government is due to unveil its drugs strategy.

    Addaction claimed that since the start of the ten-year plan in 1998, the cost of drug-related crime has risen to £100billion, with health costs adding a further £10billion.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-518369/Charity-says-illegal-drug-users-cost-taxpayers-16bn-year–3bn-spent-tackling-addiction.html#ixzz3XTDGO0i8

  49. Harri, tell us when you’re finished, ok?

  50. Not yet.

    I have billions more to save.

    Here is another easy half a billion in savings

    Lord Lipsey: Elected House of Lords could cost £484m

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-18528944

  51. Why don’t you write that stuff on your living room wall? It would be read by more people.

  52. Noel Cunning, on April 16th, 2015 at 12:41 PM Said:

    Why don’t you write that stuff on your living room wall? It would be read by more people.

    It would be read by more people if I put it on my bedroom wall 😉

  53. is that where the comedy act is shown….

  54. The Troll, on April 16th, 2015 at 12:45 PM Said:

    is that where the comedy act is shown….

    I have more kids than you 😉

    And a much younger wife.

  55. And I am not ‘ill’

    😉

  56. Harri, on April 16th, 2015 at 12:44 PM Said:

    Noel Cunning, on April 16th, 2015 at 12:41 PM Said:

    Why don’t you write that stuff on your living room wall? It would be read by more people.

    It would be read by more people if I put it on my bedroom wall 😉

    Oooops!

    I forgot the left don’t do ‘humour’ very well.

  57. How is Noel ” left “?

  58. sounds like your trying to prove something…. a trophy wife and a passel of kids. I don’t know Harri…. as for not being ill, do you have certification of that?

  59. Meanwhile, as I was saying…

    // how does the UK benefit otherwise from being a member of the EU?
    If we could turn back the clock to say 1970, would any British people choose to enter the EU? //

    Well, they did!

    No, Petr, is right here. By the look of things at the moment, the UK is set to stay in the EU for the foreseeable future. There is probably already a majority in favour of continued membership, or at least more want to stay in than want to get out. And that’s even before a referendum campaign started: once all the major parties and trade and civic organisations weigh in, but above all once Britain’s business world starts campaigning strongly for the EU, the numbers in favour of staying in will increase even further.

    It’s impossible to know how Britain would have fared if it had never joined. But the creation of a single market of 500 million people has had a very positive impact on economies and standards of living all over the continent. It brings investment to Britain and has helped make the UK such a top global financial centre. The EU has also signed free trade deals with around a third of the countries in the world, which gives the UK automatic access to export markets worth trillions of dollars. EU policy seems now to be focussed on accessing further developed and emerging markets that will, we are told, as much as double the present export figures.

    All of this could of course change if the world or EU economy shows a marked downturn, but the way things stand now British people overall see the benefits of membership, and this support is more likely to grow when the current recovery is consolidated.

  60. That should read

    “There is probably already a majority in favour of continued membership, or at least more want to stay in than want to get out.”

  61. Well, they did!

    But that wasn’t the question.

    Some British here think that at the time that the EEC as it was known then I think was sold primarily a trading bloc, and that it has instead evolved into something resembling a ” USA of Europe ” , complete with a federal government with teeth, and a bureaucracy that is huge and a political and other bureaucracy that is duplicative of the big bureaucracies that they already have in the developed EU countries

  62. //But that wasn’t the question.//

    But, as I said, it’s still the case that more in Britain want to stay in than get out, and you can be sure the currently large don’t-know group will break heavily in favour of membership once practically all established leaders in British society and British business start campaigning to stay in, which they will if it ever comes to a referendum.

    BTW, is EU bureaucracy really that big compared to the US, federal and state level?
    It certainly spends less. Despite the inevitable cost of integrating 28 different countries and economies, as well as the EU’s significantly larger population, its total public debt is still only about half the figure for the US.

  63. There’s so good ideas there Harri, some of which I symphathise with but with all due respect we’re talking about UKIP and not you.

    You really think UKIP would abolish the HOL and legalise drugs?

    UKIP won’t fill the deficit between reality and they’re manifesto pledges without raising taxes and if and when UKIP come to power and Britain is still the same shithole there’ll still be the same faces in the same places complaining about the same things with the exception being they’ll be looking for a new scapegoat, (who knows, maybe it’ll revert back to the Irish?)

    Only by a hairs breath more than I do the other bunch of pathological liars

    So you concede it’s all a matter of faith as it is with the other lot?

    Bottom line if you put it to a vote the people would vote to leave the EU

    I don’t think that that’s the case at all Troll. UKIP as a party are releatively miniscule. You need to base your assumptions on something more substantial than what you read in ATW.

  64. Here it is in 90 seconds, the key UKIP Manifesto areas:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3q3gbjdK3w

  65. Yes

    ATW is what it is but is not representative of UK or US opinion at all

  66. To construct a ‘new party’ from the dregs of the worn out remnants of the ‘old parties’ is rather akin to trying to build a functional vehicle from the rusty, decrepit pieces found in the local junk yard.

    I admit that it might be a fun thing to do, but to expect a result in anything worthwhile is a pure fantasy, – there are just too pieces that don’t quite fit well enough to get ‘the vehicle of government’ to roll down a hill let alone to drive on to anything worthwhile…

  67. Bottom line if you put it to a vote the people would vote to leave the EU

    I am a Euro-sceptic, and I am more than happy to put it to the ultimate test, with one provision, the EU mobsters are not allowed to force a second vote if the people ‘do not get it right the first time’