web analytics

HELL AIN’T A BAD PLACE TO BE

By Pete Moore On February 6th, 2019

Apparently these are the adults in the room –

Donald Tusk is the President of the European Council. Verhofstadt is a former Prime Minister of Belgium and the European Parliament’s lead on Brexit negotiations. We can put aside Tusk’s ignorance of the question we faced in June 2016 or the Article 50 process. Just look again at how these supposed friends of the British people talk about many of us.

It’s apt that Tusk thinks some of us are Demonic. The European superstate is a religion to these fanatics. Therefore Brexiteers are sinners. It is literally unholy, in their opinion, to wish to live in a sovereign, independent and self-governing nation. To prefer to hire and fire those who make our laws, instead of having them faxed from Brussels, is worthy of a place beside Beelzebub.

They’re not the first fanatics to strive for a single-state Europe. Tonight they might reflect that the last one who tried that was stopped, in part, by hundreds of thousands of British men who believed in their own country’s sovereignty and liberty.

Then they should keep on talking, because these unpleasant comments from unpleasant people have turned yet more Remainers into Leavers.

192 Responses to “HELL AIN’T A BAD PLACE TO BE”

  1. And yep –

    @DPJHodges

    Watching senior Remainers siding with Tusk, I’m genuinely starting to wonder why Brexiteers don’t start campaigning for a 2nd referendum themselves. Just for the giggles. They’d have a gay old time, and end up smashing it 70-30 or 80-20. Remainers literally don’t have a clue.

  2. Personally I cannot wait to receive our Excommunication Papers from the Holy EU Empire.

    Pete

    I do not want another Referendum on the EU, but I will take a Peoples General Election to rid ourselves of the Remainers in Parliament. And anyway, we can win by a Zimbabwean landslide and the Remainers will still be moaning, saying we never understood the question, and the two answers, that they set.

    Lord Adonis was asked what he would like the second referendum question to be ? He did not know ! You really cannot make this stuff up.

    Oh. And here is another YouTube vid you might want to look at. See Chairman May’s treachery from the inside of government.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7iaUVR8t7g

  3. They’re not the first fanatics to strive for a single-state Europe. Tonight they might reflect that the last one who tried that was stopped, in part, by hundreds of thousands of British men who believed in their own country’s sovereignty and liberty

    Brilliant!! it’s like the EUSSR or Nazi Germany or something.

    Who would have thought that the ‘tremble at our Blitz spirit’ Brextremists would have turned out to be such snowflakes 🙂

  4. And anyway, we can win by a Zimbabwean landslide

    But who’s doing the counting? A little tweek was found to have been insufficient ‘correction’ to the count last time because the Establishment dorks were only sounding out their own opinions and failed to count the regions which had been hit hard by EEC/EU membership. Besides, a referendum just wasn’t supposed to happen because David Cameron thought that he could count on the LibDems’ veto.
    No – unfortunately, there won’t be any landslide to rid us of these traitors.

  5. Oh I just knew Donald Tusk’s words today would have the Brexiteer snowflakes clutching their pearls in mock outrage . Well done Donald for showing greater real interest and compassion for the British people than the blasé “ it will all be fine” mendacity of the no deal Brexit fanatics who give not a stuff for the pain that such an outcome would cause.

  6. I don’t know what all the fuss is about Colm. He was only referring to those Brextremists who have no plan…..

  7. Oh I know Paul but the Brexiteers do have a plan. They want a “we’ll fight them on the beaches” Brexit . The fantasy of a hostile angry divorce followed by a war of attrition in which ‘David’ UK slays ‘Goliath’ EU . They are delighted with Tusk’s remarks today not furious . It’s exactly the relationship status they want with European politicians. The excitement of rival camps throwing stones rather than the boring but productive world of cooperating and sharing treats for mutual benefit. It’s childish and destructive but satisfying on an immature level.

  8. The European superstate is a religion to these fanatics.

    Yes Pete, that nails it.

    because these unpleasant comments from unpleasant people have turned yet more Remainers into Leavers.

    If only that was true. I suspect the likes of Adonis will agree with Tusk 100%.

  9. Let’s not forget that Tusk has previous. He openly mocked May last year on at least one occasion.

    And he grossly insulted the Greeks in October when he congratulated them on their “freedom” when their country’s umpteenth bailout nominally came to an end. The fact is that Greece remains crippled by years of austerity and with massive, unpayable debts imposed on it to bail out the banks of Germany and France which had lent its corrupt governments the money in the first place.

  10. Maybe someone can tell him to go to the chippy Peter?

    Of course we should agree with Tusk. If someone was to ask me would I vote in a referendum with no contingency outcome plans made before hand like most people I’d tell them to go to hell too.

  11. Peter –

    The likes of Adonis are not for turning. They are true believers.

    But since June 2016, across the country, many Remainers have turned against the EU, having discovered how it treats its friends.

  12. Never thought I’d hear Adonis being such a fan of voting. After all EVERY post this person has occupied. He has simply been appointed to. Never once bothering with tiresome voting or democracy…let that sink in.

  13. If someone was to ask me would I vote in a referendum with no contingency outcome plans made before hand like most people I’d tell them to go to hell too.

    “Leave the EU, take back control of our country” needs no contingency. Was a detailed contingency plan nailed to the door of the Dublin GPO? To the Berlin Wall? No, people decided to walk away. We decided to walk away.

    You, we know, would sell your country for a minor boost in GDP.

  14. Not so big on that British Constitutional thing then DIG?

  15. All completely comparable events Pete.

  16. Paul..if any of my post is factually incorrect do enlighten us..

  17. Who said it was factually incorrect?

    You disagree with British Parliamentary constitutionalism then?

  18. I like the Tuskmeister. He’s great at winding up the Brexit snowflakes.

  19. It’s satisfying to know that Pete Moore can still treat Brexit as a topic to make satirical jokes about with his hilarious comparisons to the fall of the Berlin Wall and the Easter rising 😉

  20. I am contrasting his newfound enthusiasm for voting with his period in National Government in which he felt no need to stand for any kind of vote whatsoever. Hypocrisy be thy name Adonis. I’m not interested in how he managed to skirt around elected office. Certainly far far less interested than you appear to be. Now why is that?

  21. Hey, you are the guys shouting about sovereignty to make your own laws etc yeah?

    You can’t really bang on about British Constitutionalism while knocking the British Constitution?

  22. Never mentioned that once. I ask you to consider the rank hypocrisy of Adonis. I’m declining to comment on your sidelining issue. Want to talk about Adonis and hypocrisy great. Otherwise…tumbleweed…

  23. Well, you didn’t mention it directly. You castigated Adonis for being appointed to one of the bicameral chambers of the Parliament you want to make your laws.

  24. No I don’t believe I did. I contrast his newfound enthusiasm for voting by reminding people that he served in National Government with it feeling the need to stand for election. That’s a fact. It’s smacks of hypocrisy. Are you saying he was elected to the HOL then? I didn’t vote for that.

  25. Are you saying Blair made him stand for an election as a Minister then? When was that?

  26. Perhaps you are saying you prefer that Brexit be appointed by some higher power now instead of a “peeeples vowte? Sadly i have to inform you we had one in 2016…and Leave won. Dont recall Adonis being that thrilled about voting then….

  27. No I don’t believe I did

    After all EVERY post this person has occupied. He has simply been appointed to. Never once bothering with tiresome voting or democracy…let that sink in.

    So the never once bothering with that tiresome democacy thing is of no relevance to the role he currently holds in the context of his anti Brexit stance then? A role that is one of the cornerstones of British Parliamentary Constitutionalism?

    Are you saying Blair made him stand for an election as a Minister then? When was that?

    Nope, not at all. I’m saying that he makes his comments in the context of being a member of one of the central tenats of the British Constitution. Tony Blair ceased being centrally in British Parliamentary politics twelve years ago, before Brexit was even heard of.

  28. Tony Blair ceased being centrally in British Parliamentary politics twelve years ago, before Brexit was even heard of.

    True Paul. But Blair was the true midwife of Brexit:

    1. He carried on with the neo-liberal Globalism started by Thatcher, which destroyed so many working class communities.
    2. He promised a referendum on the Nice Treaty, then he reneged on that promise.
    3. He went into war in Iraq, despite huge opposition, greatly undermining trust in the political system.
    4. He opened the floodgates to immigration, not just from Eastern Europe, but also from Africa and Asia.
    5. And let’s never forget that he would have had us in the Euro if Brown had not stopped him.

    Cameron is a discredited Prime Minister for sure. But there must be a special place in “Hell” for Blair.

  29. What about reports on evacuation of the queen if Brexit gets ugly? Are violent riots expected? Will Brexiteers get their heads chopped in public? Will the starving attack Westminster? Will PM May get hung from a lamppost? Will weakened UK be invaded and conquered by Belgium? It was in the Sunday Times so it must be true. Queen and Phil busy packing…

  30. By the time the “Back to the good old Empire days “ Brexitmaniacs have finished with Britain it won’t need Belgium to invade and conquer us. Liechtenstein could pull it off 😉

  31. http://daystobrexit.co.uk/

    And hell hath no fury like a Europhile scorned 🙂

    Note to self, must put Lucifer on speed dial.

  32. //True Paul. But Blair was the true midwife of Brexit//

    The claim just doesn’t stand up to scrutiny Peter and absolutely bears no relation to Adonis occupying one of the central tenats of British Parliamentary Constitutionalism that DIG holds so dear yet is complaining about.

    Could have been worse Mark. He could have called them ‘enemies of the people’ and splashed their photos and work addresses all over a tabloid front page?

  33. The true midwife of Brexit was the relentless deliberately anti Europe fervour of the U.K. tabloids implemented not out of any devotion to honest journalism but for pure commercial reasons exciting the basest of readers emotions , anger hostility and bitterness. Britain had millions of gullible idiots who believed the decades of fake news enough to tip the referendum into a stupid leave decision.

  34. no Colm the true cause is maybe just maybe the English people might want some control over the government that runs their lives. No citizen of any EU nation has that control.

    You’re all just peasants to Brussels.

  35. Yes Colm, I’ve always found it wryly amusing that the anti EU crowd scream to high heavens about foreigners meddling in internal British politics while one of the biggest political influences in Britain is an Australian – American.

    Just maybe the English people might want some control over the government that runs their lives.

    Freudian slip? The English can do whatever they want, just as long as the don’t drag Ireland down into the quagmire with them.

    No citizen of any EU nation has that control.

    You’re all just peasants to Brussels.

    Pat, for someone who’s never been outside the US let alone ever set foot in Europe the astounding ignorance in that comment almost made me spit out my coffee. Please explain yyour basis for the ridiculousness.

  36. Paul do you vote for ALL the leaders of the EU ?

    No…..

    Than you have no control and you are a peasant.

  37. No Pat, all the leaders of the EU Council are the heads of state in their respective countries voted into office by their respective nations. Did you vote for all the Congressmen in the US?

    Please explain your ridiculousness.

  38. Our States are one nation and ALL of our Leaders are elected by Americans.

    The EU is a conglomerate of once individual nations now subject to the dictates of an unaccountable politburo. That each NATION sends a representative to but has no power any longer as individual nations….

    You willingly surrendered to what the Germans were unable to win through war. Instead you’ve volunteered to be ruled by those that do not have your nations interests as a priority other than to service the needs of the conglomerate.

  39. // ALL of our Leaders are elected by Americans. //

    //Just maybe the English people might want some control over the government that runs their lives.//

    What about the people of Northern Ireland?

    Britain’s leaders are not elected in NI, and the UK government is made up of a party or parties that in fact don’t even run for election in NI. It can’t be said in any way to be elected by the people of Northern Ireland.

    The Head of State in the UK is also not elected by anyone, least of all by NI people. The upper house of parliament isn’t elected by the people either.

    NI is ruled by Britain simply because a majority there wants to keep NI in the UK.

    But a majority there wants to keep NI in the EU too.

    It’s a quare conundrum alright.

  40. The EU is a conglomerate of once individual nations now subject to the dictates of an unaccountable politburo

    Pat, the EU is a multi national economic and political bloc whose leaders are all elected by the respective nationalities within that bloc. The European Commission of 28 members, essentially the de facto senior Civil Service of the EU, is then appointed by each of the EU members.

    You really shouldn’t believe all that rubbish you read on American right wing websites.

  41. Patrick’s information (note I do not write knowledge) is surely obtained from this site and perhaps David’s other creation.

  42. Paul you have ceded your laws and sovereignty over to a non controllable government. There is no more England, no more ROI, France, Germany etc etc what there are are vassel former states ruled by unelected people that do not have the individual former nations peoples concerns as a concern.

    As we are witnessing no nation under this unelected dictatorship is allowed to leave and each former nation must do as Brussels dictates…. The European Commission of 28 members, essentially the de facto senior Civil Service of the EU, no it’s the de facto Government not just civil service. When they write the Laws they are in charge and you have no veto power over it.

    The EU was formed under the notion of a common market to compete with the US. It instead has been revealed as a dictatorship to distribute your limited resources as they believe benefit the EU and if as a Spaniard, an Irishman, or a an individual Brit you no longer really have a say or the ability to object.

  43. Paul you have ceded your laws and sovereignty over to a non controllable government.

    Pat, please list the laws and sovereignty which have been ceded. Such buzzword comments do not stand up to scrutiny.

    No it’s the de facto Government not just civil service.

    Except of course it isn’t so please explain how it is.

  44. Well if that’s the case why did the majority of Britain’s vote to leave and why has Britain been unable to leave after voting to do so?

    None of the 28 has any sovereignty. You were all conquered without a shot ever being fired… lmao

  45. If what’s the case? The UK is leaving the EU at the end of next month.

    Please list the laws and sovereignty which have been ceded by EU members and how the Euro Commission is a ‘de facto Government’. My guess is you won’t be able to and will respond with some soundbite.

    Really, you shouldn’t accept what low information dolts and crackpots on right wing websites say about the structure of the EU and try reading factual material as to its workings or at least listen to some here that know something about it.

  46. Patrick

    I think you exaggerate a bit when you say we Brits are living under an EU dictatorship.

    Yes its true that we are all required by law to have portraits of Donald Tusk and Jean Claude Juncker on prominent display in our homes, and yes we are required in public to wear pin badges of the EU flag. That’s fine although the recent law that requires the EU ‘Ode to Joy’ anthem to be broadcast 5 times a day on all public loudspeakers is a wee bit annoying. However we can live with it.

    I do think though it’s possible that the latest law requiring the speeches of all the EU Commissioners to be broadcast for 14 hours each day on the BBC might have helped prompt the Leave vote but even with all that we are not in a dictatorship. We are gloriously happy with our dear Seven Brussels leaders !

    Just ask Harri 🙂 

  47. I think that the United States should join the EU

  48. China wouldn’t allow it Phantom.

  49. Just ask Harri 🙂 

    Colm has obviously never read any of George Orwells blueprints.

  50. Colm truly believes Brussels are totally benign.

    And London is the safest City on Mother earth, where knife crime which involves mostly blacks, is all lies…lies I tells ya, or something or other.

    😏

  51. There goes the end of the logical, civil conversations we’ve had for the last short while.

  52. Colm has missed his true vocation in life.

    Colm, you would make a wonderful forelock tugging manservant for the Brussels emperor’s.

    How low did you say bow?..okay, got it..

    He is like a poor, a very poor, Neville Chamberlain when it comes to Brussels.

    EU army? Federalist Superstate, run by the few for the few..pffft.

    It will all be over by Christmas.

    😏

  53. Paul

    You have been involved. Logic doesn’t come into it..or something..or other.


  54. Well if that’s the case why did the majority of Britain’s vote to leave and why has Britain been unable to leave after voting to do so?

    None of the 28 has any sovereignty. You were all conquered without a shot ever being fired… lmao”

    Well, despite Trump being elected, there is no wall. So I guess America has no sovereignty either. Who knew?

  55. PVR

    Are you aware that citizens of the UK, RoI, etc. vote for their members of the European Parliament which makes laws? Are you aware that people from the UK, RoI, etc sit on and sometimes chair European committees such as Agriculture, Civil Liberties, etc. which administer EU countries? The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government. A person in the UK, RoI, etc. has as much sovereignty as you do as a US citizen.

  56. “The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government.”

    I personally wouldn’t make the comparison. The EU is not a federal structure (though certainly there are people throughout Europe who would want it to be). The EU is a confederation rather than a federation. In the EU the member states are sovereign. So Germany is sovereign, France is sovereign, the UK is sovereign; the EU is not sovereign. In the United States, Alabama is not sovereign, North Dakota is not sovereign, New York is not sovereign; the United States, and the federal constitution, is sovereign.

  57. None of the 28 has any sovereignty. You were all conquered without a shot ever being fired… lmao”

    Minus one.

    😀

  58. We are gloriously happy with our dear Seven Brussels leaders !

    17.4 million British patriots obviously thought different.

    I know, i know, dissent will not be tolerated, or something, or other.

    You fascist bastards.

    😏

  59. The EU is a confederation rather than a federation

    Absolutely correct.

    In terms of any alleged democratic deficit within the EU it could be argued that it’s actually more democratic than Westminster is within UK regions. As Noel states above:

    Britain’s leaders are not elected in NI, and the UK government is made up of a party or parties that in fact don’t even run for election in NI. It can’t be said in any way to be elected by the people of Northern Ireland

    And there’s also this bugbear that’s been around for a while:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Lothian_question

  60. Harri

    I think my satire went over your head. Most things do 🙂

  61. Colm.

    Forelock tugging, pushing the gold gilded chairs in, when your new masters are having a “working lunch” quaffing the finest plonk, and finest cuisine, our money can purchase, whilst bowing so low you would need to actually dig a pit to bow any lower, it appears Paul the plastic Republican would glady join you in the Brussels manservant brigade.

    😏

    Its all so terribly sad.

  62. Colm.

    When it comes to “over the head”

    Irony whooshes over your head faster than the speed of light.

    😏

  63. Colm.

    Maybe you can confirm, or deny?

    Blacks in London killing, well anyone, but mostly other blacks. Its only February 7th, and I do believe so far, nine youngsters have been knifed to death already?

    Are da local poor hard done by black yoof, attempting to break last years record?

    Or, is it simply a case of… “its all whiteys fault”?

  64. Harri

    You probably think my 2:58pm comment is factual !

  65. Colm

    None of your comments are factual.

    You are as safe as houses there.

  66. Colm.

    Here is just one example..

    Harri, on February 7th, 2019 at 5:27 PM Said:

    Colm.

    Maybe you can confirm, or deny?

    Blacks in London killing, well anyone, but mostly other blacks. Its only February 7th, and I do believe so far, nine youngsters have been knifed to death already?

    Are da local poor hard done by black yoof, attempting to break last years record?

    Or, is it simply a case of… “its all whiteys fault”?

    Well?

  67. well what ? This discussion is about Brexit. I will not discuss anything else !

  68. Colm, on February 7th, 2019 at 5:42 PM Said:
    well what ? This discussion is about Brexit. I will not discuss anything else !

    https://youtu.be/7FPELc1wEvk

    Liberals huh!

    Over head..whoosh.

    😀

  69. Colm

    Have you actually even bothered to inform your Brussels masters you are available for manservant duties?

    😏

  70. Colm.

    There’s a special place in hell waiting for you Brussels fascist Europe day dreamers.

    Your dreamy days of a new and exciting Empire…are over.

  71. Oh dear, oh deary me.

    Mark Carney’s latest gloomy predictions for the British economy have elicited all the usual told-you-so responses from Remainers with very short memories. The Bank of England has predicted 1.2% growth for 2019. Before the referendum Remainers said we would be deep in recession now…

    There was in fact another set of 2019 forecasts also released this morning – by the European Commission. The EU actually upgraded Britain’s 2019 forecast to 1.3% – the same as France, Belgium, Sweden and the Eurozone as a whole. Struggling Germany is lagging behind on 1.1% while Italy is down on 0.2%. Despite… Brexit?

    https://order-order.com/2019/02/07/eu-predicts-uk-will-grow-faster-germany-2019/

    But, but, but..

    😏

  72. What manner of dullard actually believed this spiv?

    Would you buy a used car from this con artist?

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/feb/07/billboard-campaigners-brexit-led-by-donkeys#img-2

  73. The tax evading Guardian huh!

    😏

    Oookay then.

  74. Hi Harri, I’m home 😍

  75. The tax evading Guardian huh!

    Yep, that makes a quote made by Johnson on the 11th July 2017 in the Commons about there being no plan untrue.

    What level of information deficit would someone need to have to believe such snake oil?

  76. Yes Paul but what about Black stabbings in London and Colm not seeing anyfink. That’s what really matters 😉

  77. Yes Colm and don’t forget that the Czech and Slovakia and Hungary and Poland and Ireland and Italy and Portugal and Spain and Croatia and Luxembourg and and and don’t have to have concrete bollards protecting their Christmas markets.

    Why’s that? Eh? Why’s that? Bet you can’t answer.

  78. Because the wicked evil EU megalomaniacs have bled those countries so dry ( to fund the seven magic palaces) they can’t even afford to hold Christmas markets anymore ?

    Do I win a prize for guessing correctly ? 😱

  79. Yes Paul but what about Black stabbings in London and Colm not seeing anyfink. That’s what really matters 😉

    It matter to the parents of those murdered kids.

    But not to Colm.

    London is just so safe…

    😏

  80. Comrades of the EU and NY

    New Yorker, on February 7th, 2019 at 4:41 PM Said:
    PVR

    Are you aware that citizens of the UK, RoI, etc. vote for their members of the European Parliament which makes laws? Are you aware that people from the UK, RoI, etc sit on and sometimes chair European committees such as Agriculture, Civil Liberties, etc. which administer EU countries? The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government. A person in the UK, RoI, etc. has as much sovereignty as you do as a US citizen.

    Lets look at this shall we…… We shall use the only line that you wrote that ,matters and seems to elude not just you but everyone of friends across the pod….

    The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government.

    That means that IT is the over riding control of ALL it’s member states. Each nation by DEFAULT is no longer a nation. but a small s State or territory of the EU just as Pennsylvania, New York, Virginia, etc are small s States.

    Pennsylvania, New York, Virginia, etc were Sovereign States ruled by the individual systems and Laws of Pennsylvania, New York, Virginia, etc. No Law in Pa had any effect on a Law or citizen of Virginia and so on.

    The 13 individual countries that made up the founding states ceded their sovereignty to the United States of America and once Large S States became small s states. All Laws became interconnected and the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT LAWS had complete overriding effect on any conflicting state Law.

    The EU as NYr rightly describes it IS the overriding FEDERAL GOVERNMENT to all 28 now small s states of the EU….. whether you are intelligent enough to realize it or not… You are no longer Irish, Spanish, Greek, French, etc etc you are European Unionite first and foremost… you have given up you state identity. It carries no importance except for local pride and sports teams.

  81. Oh stop the fake tears Harri. Every time there is a killing in London you are salivating with glee and quick as a flash planting comment after comment about “ bloody liberals eh ?” You love it !

  82. No Patrick, the EU is not a federal government. There is no central Government in the EU. It is a voluntary association of sovereign member states. Any Sovereign state can choose to leave simply by announcing it ( triggering the article 50 process) . Can the same be said for the individual States of the USA ?

  83. The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government

    No and no. I think you need to learn the difference between federal and confederal.

  84. The South found out during the Civil War that a Confederation is not as strong as a Federal Government!

  85. The EU is a federal government similar to the US federal government

    those are NYrs words…….

    so I guess it’s more than me that see what you can’t.

    Amen Charles

  86. I think you’va answered Colm’s question Charles.

  87. Those are NYrs words…….

    Then like you NYer is also incorrect (which wouldn’t be a first for either).

    Please list the laws and sovereignty which have been ceded by EU members and how the Euro Commission is a ‘de facto Government’. My guess is you won’t be able to and will respond with some soundbite.

    Would you like to have a go at that?

  88. Seamus

    “In the EU the member states are sovereign.” Can they pass a law that is contrary to EU law? It is generally accepted that EU law is supreme to member states law. You can play with the meaning of sovereignty but unless a country has full control of its laws it is not really sovereign.

  89. PVR

    “The 13 individual countries that made up the founding states”. They were not “individual countries” they were colonies answerable to London. They could have a type of local government but had no authority on most important issues such as economic and military.

  90. “Can they pass a law that is contrary to EU law? It is generally accepted that EU law is supreme to member states law. You can play with the meaning of sovereignty but unless a country has full control of its laws it is not really sovereign.”

    Actual sovereignty means who has the last say. The UK can withdraw from the EU without the EU’s permission. Nevada cannot withdraw from the United States without the US’s permission.

    And while there is a supremacy of EU law (in practice) in actual theory local law is key. And it is normally a local law (for example the UK’s European Communities Act) that gives EU law supremacy. So EU law only has supremacy in the UK because UK laws says it does.

  91. Seamus is correct. The commissioners appointment by the individual member states of the EU issue policy directives , some requiring unanimity, some majority decisions, These directives are not laws, they are policies that member states are required to implement how they choose. They only become laws once the Sovereign national parliaments ratify them as legal acts in their own countries. Of course their are pentalities for States who breach the directives but th fact remains, Sovereigty rests with the individual States.

  92. Harri,

    Colm has obviously never read any of George Orwells blueprints.

    I get the impression you haven’t either Harri, or if you have, you certainly haven’t understood George Orwell’s work.

  93. If a country wants to join the EU they cede their sovereignty to the EU usually by passing a law stating the same. There can be a lesser sovereignty withing individual member states. As has been said, the EU is like a club: To join you agree to play by the club’s rules. While a member of the club the club’s rules are supreme not a member’s rules. Proponents of Brexit state they want sovereignty, if the UK is sovereign what are they on about?

  94. “Proponents of Brexit state they want sovereignty, if the UK is sovereign what are they on about?”

    You’ve just hit on one of the fundamental deceits (or idiocies) of Brexiteers. They want the UK to possess something the UK already possesses.

    “If a country wants to join the EU they cede their sovereignty to the EU usually by passing a law stating the same.”

    The cede power in certain areas. They do not cede sovereignty.

  95. Seamus

    “Actual sovereignty means who has the last say.” Where does that definition come from? And, what gives it validity?

  96. Colm

    “he commissioners appointment by the individual member states of the EU issue policy directives”. What commissioners are you referring to?

  97. “Where does that definition come from? And, what gives it validity?”

    sovereignty

    noun

    supreme power or authority.

  98. Seamus

    “They want the UK to possess something the UK already possesses.” One power they cite is the ability to make trade treaties. Does the UK presently have that power or only as a member of the club? If it does presently have that power independent of being a club member, it is not sovereign.

    I agree that sovereignty means “supreme power or authority”. I maintain that is expressed in the law and we agree EU law is supreme to UK law. What does “who has the last say” have to do with it?

  99. “I maintain that is expressed in the law and we agree EU law is supreme to UK law.”

    It isn’t. EU law only has any effect in UK law because of the enabling legislation in the 1972 European Communities Act. EU law only has any effect in the UK because UK law says it does. By definition the UK law is supreme. Thus the supreme law and authority is the UK, not the EU.

    “One power they cite is the ability to make trade treaties”

    Trade is delegated to the EU. The power lies with the EU. That isn’t sovereignty. It is power. There is a distinction.

    The UK has sovereignty. In its exercise of sovereignty it has delegated power to the EU. It can take it back if it so wishes. If the EU was the sovereign entity then the UK wouldn’t be able to do that.

    North Dakota can’t take power away from the federal government, or leave the United States if it so wishes. The UK can take power away from the EU, or leave the EU if it so wishes.

  100. New Yorker

    One question will answer everything about Sovereignty.

    Does the EU as a body have to give legal permission for a member state to leave ?

  101. Seamus

    Does the UK recognize the supremacy of the Court of Justice of the European Union? If so, the EU is sovereign and the UK is not.

    “That isn’t sovereignty. It is power. There is a distinction.” Can you explain how one is distinct from the other?

  102. <i<"Does the UK recognize the supremacy of the Court of Justice of the European Union? If so, the EU is sovereign and the UK is not."

    NO it doesn’t. UK law is sovereign. The EU only has any say in the UK because of the European Communities Act.

    “Can you explain how one is distinct from the other?”

    It comes down to the final say. Who has the final say? In the United States the final say goes to the federal constitution. Thus the federal government, and in particular, the constitution is sovereign. In the UK final say goes to Parliament. And thus Parliament, not the EU, is sovereign.

  103. Colm

    “Does the EU as a body have to give legal permission for a member state to leave ?” It appears so. Is Theresa May not negotiating permission to leave? If permission is not needed why is she spending so much time on it?

  104. ” It appears so. Is Theresa May not negotiating permission to leave?”

    No. Theresa May is negotiating the relationship between the EU and the UK after leaving. She does not need to EU’s permission to leave.

  105. Seamus

    “NO it doesn’t. UK law is sovereign.” The UK signed the Lisbon Treaty.

    “In the UK final say goes to Parliament. And thus Parliament, not the EU, is sovereign.” Does the UK have final say on human rights decisions?

  106. Does the UK have final say on human rights decisions?

    Ultimately yes. The UK is bound to the European Convention on Human Rights though the UK’s domestic Human Rights Act (1998). It’s absolutely within the sovereignty of the UK Parliament to repeal the Act and not be bound by the ECHR.

    It’s also another example of the sovereignty / power distinction.

  107. ” The UK signed the Lisbon Treaty.”

    Yes they did. And?

  108. Paul McMahon

    “It’s absolutely within the sovereignty of the UK Parliament to repeal the Act and not be bound by the ECHR.” If they repealed the Act could they remain in the EU?

  109. “If they repealed the Act could they remain in the EU?”

    Broadly speaking no. The ECHR is enshrined into EU law (following the Lisbon Treaty). So in order to remain in the EU you need to follow the ECHR.

  110. Seamus

    “North Dakota can’t take power away from the federal government, or leave the United States if it so wishes.” Of course North Dakota could leave the US by seceding from the US as South Carolina did over 150 years ago. It would be against US law, but it certainly could be done. If the UK were to leave the EU it would in effect be seceding from the EU. You have been making claim to a distinction without a difference.

    Regarding the Lisbon Treaty, are you saying that in effect the European Communities Act nullifies the Lisbon Treaty?

    “No. Theresa May is negotiating the relationship between the EU and the UK after leaving. She does not need to EU’s permission to leave.” She seems to be following the EU prescription on leaving. Why is she doing that?

  111. Seamus

    “Broadly speaking no. The ECHR is enshrined into EU law (following the Lisbon Treaty). So in order to remain in the EU you need to follow the ECHR.” So, the UK is not presently sovereign in terms of human rights law. Correct?

  112. “So, the UK is not presently sovereign in terms of human rights law. Correct?”

    No. Not correct. The UK is sovereign in terms of human rights law. It comes down to choice. The UK could choose to leave the EU and get rid of human rights protections. Or it could choose to stay and keep them (or for that matter leave and keep them). The choice belongs to the UK. As such the UK is sovereign.

    A non-sovereign entity couldn’t leave the sovereign entity without the permission of the sovereign entity. So Catalonia can’t leave Spain without Spain’s agreement. Scotland can’t leave the UK without the UK’s agreement. The UK can leave the EU without the EU’s agreement.

    “Of course North Dakota could leave the US by seceding from the US as South Carolina did over 150 years ago.”

    South Carolina didn’t successfully secede from the United States. In fact, under US law, South Carolina never did secede from the United States. Rebels in South Carolina engaged in treason and rebellion. That is what the law says.

    “It would be against US law, but it certainly could be done.”

    Not legally. And wouldn’t be recognised in international law. So if North Dakota was to secede from the United States, without the US’s permission, then international law would still recognise it as part of the United States. It is why Kosovo isn’t in the UN.

    “She seems to be following the EU prescription on leaving. Why is she doing that?”

    In what manner?

  113. In fact, under US law, South Carolina never did secede from the United States. Rebels in South Carolina engaged in treason and rebellion. That is what the law says.

    Seamus, that’s right. The United States never did recognize the Confederate States of America, but maintained they were US states in rebellion. That’s why the US is said not to have blockaded the Southern ports, an act of war, but closed the ports to commerce. In fact the proper name for the Civil War is The War of Rebellion.

  114. If they repealed the Act could they remain in the EU?

    No but that’s not the crux of the debate. The point of the matter is that if there was sufficient consensus within Westminster to repeal the 98 HRA then it’s absolutely within Westminster’s sovereign competences to do so.

    That’s sovereignty.

  115. Seamus

    As a practical matter the UK is not sovereign on human rights matters. You can always bring a case to the European Court. You might be technically correct but that is hairsplitting. We live in a practical world.

    “South Carolina didn’t successfully secede from the United States. In fact, under US law, South Carolina never did secede from the United States. Rebels in South Carolina engaged in treason and rebellion. That is what the law says.” I presume you mean US law. But that was no longer material to South Carolina after they left the US. They did not intend at the time to apply for reentry into the US. They were part of the Confederacy which was in effect a new country.

    “In what manner?” Article 50.

  116. “As a practical matter the UK is not sovereign on human rights matters. You can always bring a case to the European Court. You might be technically correct but that is hairsplitting. We live in a practical world.”

    As a practical matter they are. Firstly the European Court of Human Rights is not an EU body. So now you are saying that not only is the UK not a sovereign entity, but the EU isn’t either. The Council of Europe is the sovereign entity. In your bizarre world.

    As a practical matter the UK has the deciding say on the matter. That they delegate it to the ECHR doesn’t change that. It is only through UK law that you can do it. And if UK law says you can’t then there is nothing you can do to get around that.

    Also, as a practical matter the UK has devolved education matters, economy matters etc… to Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales … does that mean that Scotland is a sovereign country? Of course not.

    “But that was no longer material to South Carolina after they left the US. “

    But they never left the United States, as Charles pointed out. And under international law (albeit current law and one that was largely not in place in 1861) South Carolina’s independence (or the Confederacy’s independence) would not have been recognised.

    And there in lies the difference between the EU (a non-sovereign entity) and the United States (a sovereign entity). Obviously places can leave a nation illegally (Russia’s annexation of Crimea for example). However it is largely recognised in international law that a body cannot leave a sovereign entity without the leave of the sovereign entity (which is why Crimea is still recognised by the international community as part of Ukraine, Kosovo part of Serbia, Abhkasia as part of Georgia etc…). The UK can leave the EU without the EU’s permission. South Carolina cannot, and was not allowed, to leave the US without the US’s permission.

    “Article 50.”

    Article 50 is simply notification. The UK was informing the EU that it was leaving. Technically it doesn’t even need to do that. UK law is supreme. If Parliament passed a law saying the UK is no longer in the EU then there is bugger all the EU can do about it (legally or otherwise).

  117. As a practical matter the UK has the deciding say on the matter. That they delegate it to the ECHR doesn’t change that. It is only through UK law that you can do it. And if UK law says you can’t then there is nothing you can do to get around that

    That’s the nub of the sovereignty discussion that NYer doesn’t seem to be able / want to grasp.

  118. // the European Court of Human Rights is not an EU body. So now you are saying that not only is the UK not a sovereign entity, but the EU isn’t either.//

    🙂

  119. Come on New Yorker admit it. You are wrong on the Sovereignty matter re. EU countries. There’s no shame in admitting it 😉

  120. A member of a federal state does not have sovereignty in the same way that a stand alone country that isn’t in such an intrusive organization ( Japan, Canada ) has sovereignty.

    This isn’t meant to be a pro or anti EU comment either, though it will immediately be misinterpreted as one.

    EU nations are in a different category than all the other nations of the world are. It shouldn’t be seem as inflammatory or anti EU to say that.

  121. “EU nations are in a different category than all the other nations of the world are.”

    With regards to power, not with regards to sovereignty. The UK delegates that power to the EU. The EU doesn’t have it by right. The EU can’t demand that the UK give it to them.

    The UK is as sovereign in the UK as the United States is in the US, or Australia is in Australia, or as Japan and Canada are in their respective countries.

    That the UK grants power to the EU doesn’t mean that it grants sovereignty.

  122. You’re entitled to your opinion.

    I think that when so much power is ceded over time, that it becomes a ceding of sovereignty.

  123. “I think that when so much power is ceded over time, that it becomes a ceding of sovereignty.”

    If that was true then the UK wouldn’t be able to leave the EU. It legally wouldn’t be allowed to do it. That is clearly not the case.

  124. It doesn’t matter how much power is ceded. It is the issue of consent that decides Sovereignty. As long as a State is free voluntarily to leave an organisation whenever it wishes it has 100% Sovereignty.

  125. yeah brexit is showing how easy it is……

  126. //EU nations are in a different category than all the other nations of the world are.//

    Even nations like Rhode Island?

  127. //yeah brexit is showing how easy it is……//

    Patrick, the difficulties in Brexit are difficulties within the British parliament and the British people.
    There are several ways of leaving the EU, and the British – parliament and people – can’t decide on which one to take, i.e. each option is the choice ony of a minority.

    If there were a majority for some particular form of departure, then there would be no difficulties in Brexit.

  128. A member of a federal state does not have sovereignty in the same way that a stand alone country that isn’t in such an intrusive organization ( Japan, Canada ) has sovereignty.

    I disagree. Much like being a bit pregnent you’re either sovereign or you aren’t and, as explained at length on this thread, ultimately the sovereign power of each EU state rests with itself.

    I think that when so much power is ceded over time, that it becomes a ceding of sovereignty.

    How much time? Both Ireland and the UK have been in the EU over 45 years.

    Yeah brexit is showing how easy it is……

    As I explained to you above Pat, the UK is leaving the EU at the end of next month. What is being played out is the polarisation that Brexit has caused in British society and the fact that the EU prepared for negiations regarding EU / UK relations after the end of next month and the UK didn’t.

  129. Even on this site, there is significant difference of opinion on the British side of the house, with at least two ( Colm, New Yorker ) saying that Brexit was a big error.

  130. Seamus

    “And under international law (albeit current law and one that was largely not in place in 1861) South Carolina’s independence (or the Confederacy’s independence) would not have been recognised.” I can assure you SC left the US and many died because it did so. Your statement demonstrates the unreality of your position.

    Your defense of UK sovereignty coming from an Irishman is priceless, and it is also wrong. Sovereignty is at the heart of Brexit. If it is not an issue, as you claim, there certainly is much hubbub about it. One wonders what all the fuss is about! If Brexiteers only adopted your enlightened position, months of travail would have been avoided. Nonetheless, the battle still rages. Why is that?

  131. “I can assure you SC left the US and many died because it did so. Your statement demonstrates the unreality of your position.”

    You can assure me all you like. Legally speaking it didn’t.

    “Your defense of UK sovereignty coming from an Irishman is priceless, and it is also wrong. “

    Well go fuck yourself.

    “Sovereignty is at the heart of Brexit. If it is not an issue, as you claim, there certainly is much hubbub about it. “

    Yes because morons like yourself can’t seem to learn the difference between the delegation of power and sovereignty.

    ” If Brexiteers only adopted your enlightened position, months of travail would have been avoided.”

    Probably the smartest thing you’ve ever said.

  132. Your defense of UK sovereignty coming from an Irishman is priceless

    What a pile of mean spirited bollocks. Seamus takes the time to explain to you at length why the UK, (and all other EU members), are ultimately their own sovereign states and your response is a totally unrelated jibe.

    You got it wrong yet again. FFS have the humility to bow out with dignity.

  133. Seamus

    “Well go fuck yourself.” I see you do not appreciate wit. I also see how well mannered you are.

  134. Paul McMahon

    “What a pile of mean spirited bollocks.” It is wit: Do you not appreciate it?

    “You got it wrong yet again.” No. My arguments stand up, those of Seamus do not in the real world. I have little time for hairsplitting that is meaningless.

  135. Paul, Seamus Noel and anyone else with common sense and logic.

    New Yorker is not stupid and he knows hs arguments about Sovereignty here are wrong but he enjoys the ‘Devils Advocat’ approach. He knows our views on this matter are correct.

  136. You are incorrect and have been proved incorrect numerous times on this thread

    Power can be designated but sovereignty can rescind that designation. That’s the crux.

  137. Colm

    “He knows our views on this matter are correct.” Your views are incorrect. Now, prove my arguments are wrong.

  138. Now, prove my arguments are wrong.

    What arguments? Any half hearted argument you have made here has been systematically deconstructed. Just follow the thread.

  139. NY

    I and others have done so many times on this thread. There is no point in repeating proof that you fail to acknowledge.

  140. Colm

    I have not been disproved on the supremacy of EU law. I have not been disproved on human rights issues being decided above the UK. I have not been disproved on non-independence of trade treaty ability.

    You are believing what is convenient for you. Do you believe, as Seamus does, that the sovereignty issue for Brexiteers is not an issue at all? Do you think they are so dense that they cannot see the truth of Seamus’ position?

  141. I have not been disproved on the supremacy of EU law. I have not been disproved on human rights issues being decided above the UK

    The UK is bound to the European Convention on Human Rights though the UK’s domestic Human Rights Act (1998). It’s absolutely within the sovereignty of the UK Parliament to repeal the Act and not be bound by the ECHR.

    It’s also another example of the sovereignty / power distinction.

  142. Paul McMahon

    “Power can be designated but sovereignty can rescind that designation. That’s the crux.” If a member state rescinds the power, it is out of the club. Correct? It seems to me that you are making a theoretical statement that if effected would bring expulsion from the club. So, other than some meaningless theoretical value, what good is it in the real and practical world. We know leaving the club would likely bring a disastrous result, so no sane person would advocate for it and therefore the Brexiteers are insane.

  143. Paul McMahon

    “The UK is bound to the European Convention on Human Rights though the UK’s domestic Human Rights Act (1998). It’s absolutely within the sovereignty of the UK Parliament to repeal the Act and not be bound by the ECHR.” How likely is it the UK parliament will repeal the act? If they did repeal it, would UK citizens have ECHR protection when in other EU countries?

  144. How likely is it the UK parliament will repeal the act? If they did repeal it, would UK citizens have ECHR protection when in other EU countries?

    The short answer is I don’t know.

    It seems to me that you are making a theoretical statement

    Of course it’s theroretical, this whole conversation is theroretical. I didn’t comment on whether they’d do it, I said they could if there was consenseus in the Parliament it could absolutely be repealed.

    That’s Parliamentary sovereignty. Ultimate power resting in, in this case, Westminster.

  145. Paul McMahon

    “Of course it’s theroretical, this whole conversation is theroretical.” Since Brexit is the current major issue, it is not only theoretical.

    The bottom line is this: If the arguments for UK sovereignty can convince Brexiteers they are wrong, such arguments have merit; if they cannot convince them such arguments are worthless. The Brexiteers believe the UK will regain sovereignty with Brexit, so if they can be convinced that is a false premise, that would be a good thing. But other than on this blog, where is the argument being made?

  146. NYer, what Brexiteers think or don’t think has absolutely no bearing on the reality I outline above.

    As I said, power can be designated but sovereignty can rescind that designation, and every single national Parliament of respective EU members retains that sovereignty.

    That’s the nuance that you either fail or don’t want to grasp.

  147. Back to Donald Tusk, and it would appear that there is a place in Hell for him…..

    https://wwwkevboyle.blogspot.com/2019/02/a-special-place-in-hell.html

    A SMILING PRESIDENT KOMOROWSKI GREETS PRESIDENT DONALD TUSK WHILE AWAITING THE COFFINS OF SMOLENSK VICTIMS

    From Wikipedia:
    On 10 April 2010, a Tupolev Tu-154 aircraft of the Polish Air Force crashed near the city of Smolensk, Russia, killing all 96 people on board. Among the victims were the President of Poland Lech Kaczyński and his wife Maria, the former President of Poland in exile, Ryszard Kaczorowski, the chief of the Polish General Staff and other senior Polish military officers, the president of the National Bank of Poland, Polish Government officials, 18 members of the Polish Parliament, senior members of the Polish clergy and relatives of victims of the Katyn massacre.

  148. Paul McMahon

    “NYer, what Brexiteers think or don’t think has absolutely no bearing on the reality I outline above.” That is beside the point. You can be off in never never theory land and Brexit and a hard border will happen. As I said, the sovereignty argument is worthless unless it can counter the Brexit position. That may not matter to you, but it does to many people.

    The question remains: Other than on this blog, where is the argument being made?

  149. As I said, the sovereignty argument is worthless unless it can counter the Brexit position

    No it’s not, if factual reality and doesn’t exist to ‘counter the Brexit position’. Sovereign power rests with the national governments of each individual EU member much in the same way that if I don’t want to belong to a club then I don’t have to join / I can leave. I am absolutely autonomous in making that decision.

    The question remains: Other than on this blog, where is the argument being made?

    I don’t know. And?

  150. // If they did repeal it, would UK citizens have ECHR protection when in other EU countries?//

    Of course they would. Everyone in the signatory states is of course protected by the ECHR.

    I thought it was only Patrick who believed that laws in a country apply only to that country’s nationals, in his case that the only Americans have the protection of US laws.

    // If a member state rescinds the power, it is out of the club//

    That’s generally what being a member of a club means – you join and give the club the right to make rules binding on all members because you consider such an arrangement has benefits for all. Withdrawing that right from the club means withdrawing from the club. Yes, that should be obvious.

  151. = that only Americans

  152. I refuse to join any club that would have me as a member……

  153. // As I said, the sovereignty argument is worthless unless it can counter the Brexit position.//

    You seem to be missing something very fundamental, NY.

    Brexit proves sovereignty. There’s no need for any other argument

  154. The UK should join the USA

    Just agree to start Driving on the right side of the road like normal people, and I’ll get you an invitation

  155. They drive on the right in Israel

  156. They drive on the left in Cyprus and Malta and South Africa and Australia and New Zealand and Hong Kong.

  157. https://www.rhinocarhire.com/Car-Hire-Blog/August-2009/Which-Countries-Drive-on-the-Left,–a-Handy-Guide.aspx

  158. I thought it would be weighted more the other way

  159. Nice map, Phantom.

    I think the first regulations on this were on the occasion of a church congress in Rome around 1300 AD. There were so many delegates and pilgrims, and tens of thousands of prostitutes, flowing into the city to attend the congress that the Roman authorities decreed that those crossing a bridge across the Tiber would cross on one side (the left?) to avoid chaos.

    For hundreds of years, before there were laws on the matter in Europe, people used to ride horses on the left side of the road in order to leave the rider’s right hand free to draw a sword and fight any enemy attacking from the front. The same was true for the small carts and chariots they used to use.
    (this is also the reason why all spiral staircases in medieval castles and towers rise in a clockwise direction – the defender, at the top, then had the advantage of having more swinging room for the sword in his right hand to fight attackers coming from below).

    But later when they started using larger carts with teams of four horses, the driver would sit on the rear left horse so he could better apply the whip on the team with his right hand. Naturally they wanted to have a clear view of the road to let approaching traffic pass, so they started driving on the right side.
    This became regulation in France and Napoleon brought it to the rest of Europe (but, as we know, never conquered England).

    In Phantom’s map, all the “left-side” countries – except Japan, Thailand and Indonesia – are former members of the British Empire, which is why they kept driving on the left.
    Indonesia had been Dutch long before Napoleon imposed French traffic rules on the Netherlands, so it kept the old left.side rule.
    Japan’s railway system was built by British engineers using British rolling stock, so they organised it according to the British system, and I think this led to the general regulation on left-side driving there.
    I’m guessing the same is true for Thailand.

    A curious event took place in Sweden, and I think Norway too, in 1967, which until then drove on the left. At a certain minute of a certain day, all traffic in the whole country switched sides and started driving on the right.

    (and, No, this way not an order from the EU)

    https://www.thelocal.se/20170904/the-day-sweden-switched-to-driving-on-the-right

  160. Interesting post Noel, thank you.
    I’d heard a rumour that it was Napoleon who actually introduced driving on the right to most of Europe.

  161. Most countries drive on the right or the left, except the Italians, they just rev up and drive…. 😱

  162. But the Italians also stay within one half of the road.

    Unfortunately it’s always the half in the middle.

  163. (and, No, this way not an order from the EU)

    Why?

    Does the “free trade area” laughably also known as just a %common market” give orders then?

    If they do, it obviously doesn’t apply to the Fatherland.

    How Merkel’s Germany is legally ALLOWED TO IGNORE EU rules all other nations cave in to
    EUROPEAN Union bosses show a flagrant disregard for their own rules by allowing Germany to ignore the bloc’s laws that other weaker countries are forced to abide by, Express.co.uk can reveal today.
    By JOE BARNES, BRUSSELS CORRESPONDENT

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1084402/EU-news-Germany-Angela-Merkel-European-Commission-law-rule-Court-of-Justice

  164. I wonder if Germany will ignore their impending recession?

  165. Uh Oh ! Here comes Harry with his only in the EXPRESS FACTS bulletins 🙂

  166. How Merkel’s Germany is legally ALLOWED TO IGNORE EU rules all other nations cave in to
    EUROPEAN Union bosses show a flagrant disregard for their own rules by allowing Germany to ignore the bloc’s laws that other weaker countries are forced to abide by, Express.co.uk can reveal today

    Isn’t it great how the sExpress helpfully put the point they’re trying to push in caps just in case their high information ‘readers’ can’t grasp it?

    Express.co.uk can reveal today

    Yeah, just 11 years later 🙂

    https://eutopialaw.com/2011/10/24/%E2%80%9Cthe-german-constitutional-court-versus-the-eu-self-assertion-in-theory-and-submission-in-practice-%E2%80%93-euro-aid-and-financial-guarantees-part-1/

  167. Colm

    So, Germany doesn’t ignore EU rules then?

    Fine, I accept that..

    Now prove it?

    Good luck Colm.

    😏

    Colm, you really are a funny guy. A gullible funny guy, but quite entertaining at times.

    😀

  168. Yeah, just 8 years later

  169. Isn’t it great how the sExpress

    All my own work..

    Paul McMahon aged 12…and a half.

    The sExpress!!

    😂😂😂😂😂

    My very own little ATW troll has arrived.

  170. Express.co.uk can reveal today

    Yeah, just 11 years later 🙂

    You were had, like all the other low information unthinking dullards. Own it 🙂

  171. Paul McMahon, on February 9th, 2019 at 2:12 PM Said:
    How Merkel’s Germany is legally ALLOWED TO IGNORE EU rules all other nations cave in to
    EUROPEAN Union bosses show a flagrant disregard for their own rules by allowing Germany to ignore the bloc’s laws that other weaker countries are forced to abide by, Express.co.uk can reveal today

    Isn’t it great how the sExpress helpfully put the point they’re trying to push in caps just in case their high information ‘readers’ can’t grasp it?

    Express.co.uk can reveal today

    I can only put it down to boredom?

    Yawn..Zzzzzzzzzzzzz

    😀

  172. Yeah, just 8 years later

  173. A gullible funny guy, but quite entertaining at times.

    Oh the sweet, sweet irony 🙂

  174. Hmmmm!

    Maybe its just me?

    But there is something simply delicious about owning your very own plastic Irishman pretend Republican little troll.

    😂

  175. Yup.

    Its boredom.

    😂

  176. I can see the next Express headline

    TANGLED WEB blog goes into MELTDOWN as LOOPY Harri RAGES at mild mannered Paul and Colm !

  177. Colm.

    You mean “sExpress”?

    Shurely?

    No?

    I get it, okay, apart from the very obvious fact to anyone over the age of eleven…and a half, the Express never mentions ” sex” (apart from those with the mental age of a child) Hi Paul!

    Colm, Paul..mild mannered, and has the mental age of someone over the age of 12?

    Bwaaaaahahahaha…

    😂

    Colm.

    Leave well alone, Paul McMahon is my own little plastic Irish Republican troll

    Not yours.

    Mine.

    😀

  178. Come on Harri, share and share alike. We all get to play with each other in this cosy little web 🙂

  179. Colm, Paul..mild mannered, and has the mental age of someone over the age of 12?

    Bwaaaaahahahaha…

    😂

    Colm.

    Leave well alone, Paul McMahon is my own little plastic Irish Republican troll

    Not yours.

    Mine.

    😀

    Colm.

    I’m a proper Englishman if you don’t mind, not some befuddled pretend plastic liberal Irishman living in the multicultural hell hole called London.

    You can’t, and never could understand the importance of owning your very own plastic, and very bored, and boring pretend Irish Republican living in Espania.

    Leave well alone.

    Paul McMahon the ultimate bore, belongs to me…not you.

    😂

  180. Colm, on February 9th, 2019 at 3:28 PM Said:
    Come on Harri, share and share alike. We all get to play with each other in this cosy little web 🙂

    No come on about it Colm.

    Paul McMahon the plastic Republican, belongs to me, not you.

    And make absolutely no mistake about it.

    Why do you think, hours, days could go by, and the minute I post, Paul McMahon posts?

    As I said, he’s my little troll, no one else’s.

    I will do with him as I wish..or not, as the case maybe.

    I’m English, he knows his place.

    😀

  181. Colm, on February 9th, 2019 at 2:41 PM Said:
    I can see the next Express headline

    Colm.

    With all due respect.

    You live in a warzone called London..

    Caused mainly by blacks killing Black’s, and anyone else who unfortunately crosses their path, yet apparently, and even more staggeringly, still won’t admit “there’s a demographic problem here”?

    So please, excuse me if I ignore any “advice” you prefer to offer.

    😏

  182. Harri, on February 9th, 2019 at 3:41 PM Said:
    Colm, on February 9th, 2019 at 2:41 PM Said:
    I can see the next Express headline

    Colm.

    With all due respect.

    You live in a warzone called London..

    Caused mainly by blacks killing Black’s, and anyone else who unfortunately crosses their path, yet apparently, and even more staggeringly, still won’t admit “there’s a demographic problem here”?

    So please, excuse me if I ignore any “advice” you prefer to offer.

    😏

    Almost forgot…

    Colm, I’m entirely surprised you can see the next “sExpress” headline. ( apologies I couldn’t resist it) 😀 I wouldn’t have truly believed you cab actually see past the end of your nose?

    “The sExpress”?

    Methinks, Paul the plastic Irish Republican, has been subjected to far too many copies of the Sunday Sport?

    I always suspected he was a wanker.

  183. //Paul..mild mannered, and has the mental age of someone over the age of 12?//

    Well, it’s good to know at least someone has.

  184. 4 in a row! Harri’s on the sauce.

    Looks like Ireland back to winning ways in Edinburgh. Proper order.

  185. “The Lie Mail

    The sExpress?

    https://youtu.be/zjedLeVGcfE

    😂

  186. Looks like Ireland back to winning ways in Edinburgh. Proper order.

    Celt against Celt.

    Someone’s got to lose.

    😏

  187. 4 in a row! Harri’s on the sauce.

    Nope, not triggered at all. Well played Colm 🙂

    You have to admit though, it is pretty hilarious to watch him put them up just to have them knocked down again 🙂 His tenacity for being gullible, (typical sExpress dullard), is fascinating.

    Paul McMahon, on January 24th, 2019 at 10:24 PM Said:

    Typical Harri conversation on ATW:

    Harri – ‘Yeah, but ‘Ze Commission’ and the halls of Brussels and, and, and’

    Sensible people – No, Harri. This is why you’re incorrect, because, (follows a basic outline which demonstrates that Harri clearly hasn’t a notion of what he’s howling about).

    Harri – ‘Yeah, because Paul and Noel are plastics and Phantom’s a state agent and Seimi’s a girl and Bobby Sands is spinning and Colm and Dave and Seamus and MourneReg and, and, and’

    Sensible people – Silently shake their head and smile wryly.

  188. Well if Paul is Harri’s ‘Plastic Paddy’ toy. Harri is my very own ‘wind up Gammon’ doll. When I’m a bit bored I just twist his key and watch it race around the room waving the express in one hand and a copy of Juncker expenses allowance in the other. I have to be careful not to wind the key too much in case the head explodes. I don’t think Poundland would give me a refund on my defective doll 😉

  189. Morning Harri

    I wonder how far I should turn your key today ? 😄

  190. Colm

    Its the afternoon?

    And you mean the sExpress….shorely

    😁

  191. I don’t think Poundland would give me a refund on my defective doll 😉

    Poundland.?

    Colm, you peasant..😏

  192. Well can you think of anywhere else that would sell my Harri doll ?