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WAIT, HE DID WHAT?

By Pete Moore On May 24th, 2019

If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear, right commies? The president seems cool with putting everything out there. I’m not sure that the coup plotters will be feeling quite so comfortable.

73 Responses to “WAIT, HE DID WHAT?”

  1. Trump is a clear and present danger to the US constitution and his apologists like Pete Moore need to wake up:

    “Call it what you will – a constitutional crisis, conflict or mere contretemps; call it a banana. The fact remains that by categorically refusing to recognise congressional power to oversee the executive branch – power exercised very aggressively by congressional Republicans against the Democratic administrations of Barack Obama and Bill Clinton – Trump and his henchmen have elevated the president above the law. He might as well erect a gold-plated ‘l’état, c’est moi’ sign on the White House lawn…

    According to the president’s attorney, Congress simply has no power to investigate possible presidential corruption, even for the stated purpose of enacting legislation preventing such corruption in the future. Pursuant to this theory of an unaccountable executive, Congress is not the co-equal branch of government outlined in the constitution: it is toothless and subordinate to the executive branch. As the judge observed, this Trumpian vision of an imperial president means that the congressional investigation of Nixon’s criminal conduct, leading to his impeachment and resignation, as well as extensive investigations of Bill Clinton, were unconstitutional. Trump’s attorney did not disagree.

    The subpoena at issue in this case is one of many that the administration is flouting. According to the Washington Post, it is stonewalling 20 congressional investigations, involving Trump’s conduct in office, his policies and his finances (including a demand for his tax returns that Congress has explicit legal authorisation to issue). The administration has refused at least 79 requests for documents or other information and barred Trump’s aides from testifying before Congress…”

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2019/05/20/the-trumpian-threat-to-democracy/?utm_source=Weekly+newsletter&utm_campaign=9a9bcbe329-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2019_05_24_02_24&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_7e9712ba33-9a9bcbe329-74446537

  2. if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear, right commies?

    Is that why he is fighting so hard to conceal his finances, after he said that he would disclose his tax returns?

  3. yes god forbid he exercise his 4th and 5th amendment rights he must be guilty…. we don’t know what he’s guilty of and couldn’t find anything over the past 2 years so hey give us all the records of your life BEFORE you were President and we’ll find something…..

  4. Peter a man of your stature should not be indulging in hallucinogenic drugs.

  5. Peter a man of your stature should not be indulging in hallucinogenic drugs.

    Is that the best you can do?

    Why not try addressing the points raised, like Trump’s attorney admitting that he regards the Watergate investigation as illegal and pushing the doctrine that the President is above the law?

  6. The other recent presidents had no problem releasing their tax returns.

    What’s this guy’s problem

  7. Maybe he has something to hide?

    Just saying.

  8. “yes god forbid he exercise his 4th and 5th amendment rights he must be guilty”

    He has already supplied the government with those documents so his individual rights don’t matter. You can’t supply the government with documents and then insist that your privacy is being infringed by the government looking at them.

  9. The UK –

    Did you see that ridiculous political peagant today? Once again we’ve reached previously unchartered territories of farcical political tomfoolery.

    The US –

    Here, hold my crackpipe:

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-treason-comey-mccabe-strzok-page-white-house-a8928556.html?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR07N1wq2I-kU-ciA3eUUmfDKA80TJnCJEXY8hZkrIzQo5oXeh9dQoCj7go#Echobox=1558697629

  10. The other recent presidents had no problem releasing their tax returns.

    What’s this guy’s problem

    Isn’t he being ‘assessed?’

  11. Trump should be careful about the treason allegations. Subverting the constitution is treason.

  12. Yes, that’s the fake excuse that he is being audited

    I don’t know how in the world an audit means that the information can’t be shared, but maybe that makes sense to somebody

  13. How odd.

    For two years all the commies wanted to talk about was the Russians. Now they want to talk about anything but Russians.

    It went quiet, very quickly.

  14. Phantom, on May 24th, 2019 at 7:52 PM Said:
    The other recent presidents had no problem releasing their tax returns.

    What’s this guy’s problem

    Who was the first President to release his tax records and why?

  15. Trump is bringing his entire adult family and spouses for the state visit next month, at the expense of US taxpayers (a group that it seems he does not belong to). It is expected that they will all stay in Buckingham Palace, so they will at least spare the US taxpayers the five star hotel bills:

    “When Donald Trump makes his state visit to the UK next month he will bring his own version of a royal court, in the form of all his adult children and their spouses, according to US news reports.

    Neither Buckingham Palace nor the White House has confirmed the guest list for the state banquet dinner on 3 June, but ABC News reported the US president would be accompanied by his wife, Melania, his daughter Ivanka and her husband, Jared Kushner – who both work in the White House – as well as his other daughter, Tiffany, his sons Donald Jr and Eric, and Eric’s wife, Lara.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/may/23/donald-trump-uk-state-visit-adult-children

  16. How long can it take to “audit” a tax return? No, lemme guess, two terms maybe?

  17. I suppose it takes years to audit all those billions right enough.

  18. Peter what about the problem of the 4th and 5th Amendments?

    Was Trump a Government Official or Employee before he was President….. No

    It is NOT Oversight to view a persons personal records from before they held any public position without a predicating crime.

  19. Now they want to talk about anything but Russians.

    No Pete, Mueller made clear that Trump’s campaign was assisted by the Russians, and that he was only too glad to exploit their hacking of the Democrats. Heck, he even encouraged them publicly to “hack some more!”

    It’s just that there is so much else to attack against this corrupt bigotted buffoon. Today he called for the former head of the FBI to be tried for treason, a capital offence. What’s not to like?

  20. Patrick

    Congress has the right to investigate a President. Please read the article I linked to.

  21. Memo to Buckingham Palace:

    Keep a close eye on the silverware.

  22. 🙂

  23. “Peter what about the problem of the 4th and 5th Amendments?”

    What problem? He has supplied the documents to the government. By definition he has no reasonable expectation of privacy. If you supply the government with documents you can’t expect the government to not look at them.

  24. They do, they don’t have the right to investigate his life before he was President and was a PRIVATE Citizen.

    The Fourth Amendment (Amendment IV) to the United States Constitution is part of the Bill of Rights. It prohibits unreasonable searches and seizures. In addition, it sets requirements for issuing warrants: warrants must be issued by a judge or magistrate, justified by probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and must particularly describe the place to be searched and the persons or things to be seized.

    Amendment V
    No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

  25. What problem? He has supplied the documents to the government. By definition he has no reasonable expectation of privacy. If you supply the government with documents you can’t expect the government to not look at them.

    not in this country sorry

  26. Peter what about the problem of the 4th and 5th Amendments?

    But we’re referring to Presidential custom right? And you’re right, it’s not obligatory to release tax returns but as Pete says above: if you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear so why break Presidential custom if there’s nothing to hide?

    Pat, I seem to remember you stating just after the election that he couldn’t release his tax returns because of being under audit. Is my memory correct?

  27. “not in this country sorry”

    Yes in your country. Donald Trump is not being asked to provide anything. He is not being asked to hand over documents. He is not being subject to a search.

    The IRS and the Department of the Treasury are being ordered by Congress to turn over all papers requested that are currently being held by the IRS and the Department of the Treasury.

  28. No I believe I said that’s what he was claiming….. Nixon was under Audit when he released his and he was the first……

    The famous quote “The People need to know whether or not their President is a crook” comes from.

  29. “The famous quote “The People need to know whether or not their President is a crook” comes from.”

    And now you don’t care whether or not your President is a crook?

  30. Since Trump is the most honest president ever, I am sure that he will be happy to share his tax returns.

    He’s really honest, not like that bad Bill Clinton.

  31. IRS Documents are protected under the 4th Amendment.

    Without a predicating crime if the IRS releases them to anyone even congress without a court order it is a FELONY.

    You need a predicating crime.

  32. But he’s really honest, you said so.

    Maybe he’s shy and doesn’t want us to know how pure he is.

  33. And now you don’t care whether or not your President is a crook?

    The whole country knows Trump is as clean as a whistle. He just had a two year anal exam that proved it.

  34. Phantom what’s your real name……. Maybe you’re just shy

  35. The whole country knows Trump is as clean as a whistle.

    Yeah, that’s why he keeps his tax returns secret.

  36. “IRS Documents are protected under the 4th Amendment.”

    No they are not.

    From the (Trump) IRS:

    However, the courts have consistently held that disclosure of routine financial information required on a tax return does not incriminate an individual or violate the right to privacy.

    “You need a predicating crime.”

    No you don’t. The Revenue Act of 1924 specifically gives Congressional Committees the right to access tax information on citizens, and also the power to decide whether that information should be made public. The Tax Reform Act of 1976 retains the right of tax committees to do so as long as a disclosure served a legitimate committee purpose.

  37. “The whole country knows Trump is as clean as a whistle. He just had a two year anal exam that proved it.”

    No it didn’t. It provided several potentially indictable moments. The only thing preventing Trump from being indicted was the Justice Department’s opinion that a sitting President can’t be indicted.

  38. The Tax Reform Act of 1976 retains the right of tax committees to do so as long as a disclosure served a legitimate committee purpose.

    Without a predicating crime there is NO LEGITIMATE PURPOSE.

    Just fishing to see if you can find something is not legitimate.

  39. Patrick is a CPA, a tax lawyer as well as being an authority on the Constitution.

  40. “Without a predicating crime there is NO LEGITIMATE PURPOSE.”

    Nonsense. If crime was the only grounds for it they wouldn’t have granted that power to Congress. Congress is not a policing organisation.

    And there are plenty of legitimate purposes for Congress having access to someone, especially Trump’s, tax returns.

  41. The only thing preventing Trump from being indicted was the Justice Department’s opinion that a sitting President can’t be indicted.

    I wonder how constitutional that opinion is. Suppose Trump stabbed Pelosi in front of the cameras. Would he get a pass?

  42. No it didn’t. It provided several potentially indictable moments. The only thing preventing Trump from being indicted was the Justice Department’s opinion that a sitting President can’t be indicted.

    That’s a Lie.

    Mueller said that he did not hold that view and it did not influence him in any way, but hey if the man who hired 19 Hillary lawyers to try and find a reason to indict him says that it didn’t matter why should it stop you from insisting it did.

  43. “Mueller said that he did not hold that view and it did not influence him in any way, but hey if the man who hired 19 Hillary lawyers to try and find a reason to indict him says that it didn’t matter why should it stop you from insisting it did.”

    Where did Mueller say that he didn’t hold that view?

  44. They didn’t grant congress the power to violate the 4th amendment to go fishing for a crime.

  45. “They didn’t grant congress the power to violate the 4th amendment to go fishing for a crime.”

    They aren’t looking for a crime. They are looking for conflicts of interest. Where his business interests interfere in the interests of the United States. And then looking to see if he favoured his personal businesses in those matters or favoured the affairs of the United States.

    And it isn’t a 4th Amendment violation. He has already turned those papers over to the federal government. This will simply be another branch of the federal government looking at them. Thus he has no reasonable expectation of privacy.

  46. “I wonder how constitutional that opinion is.”

    Hard to say. The constitution makes no difference, on paper anyway, between the President and any other officer of the United States. And other officers of the United States have been indicted before being impeached. So on paper it is possible.

    A 1970s legal opinion (from the Department of Justice following Watergate) suggested that because of the uniqueness of the President’s office (the sole person to whom all Executive power is vested) the indictment of a sitting President would be such a constitutionally traumatic event to render it impossible.

  47. They aren’t looking for a crime. They are looking for conflicts of interest. Where his business interests interfere in the interests of the United States. And then looking to see if he favoured his personal businesses in those matters or favoured the affairs of the United States.

    That is called BRIBERY and it’s a crime.

  48. “That is called BRIBERY and it’s a crime.”

    Its not. He may act in his personal interests and against the interests of the United States without ever being bribed. It just might be a deal is really good for him and really bad for America.

  49. It is exceptionally bizarre that anyone would want to run for president in the modern era while keeping tax returns concealed.

    All this shooting his mouth off about ” Crooked Hillary ” partially to distract attention from his own murky finances.

    People actually believed that this walking three card monte game would clean up the swamp of corruption?

  50. IRS Documents are protected under the 4th Amendment.

    Without a predicating crime if the IRS releases them to anyone even congress without a court order it is a FELONY.

    You need a predicating crime

    Pat, why are you hiding behind criminal procedure when this issue at hand is clearly Presidential custom & tradition?

    Why would Donnie break Presidential custom & tradition if he has nothing to hide?

  51. A 1970s legal opinion (from the Department of Justice following Watergate) suggested that because of the uniqueness of the President’s office (the sole person to whom all Executive power is vested) the indictment of a sitting President would be such a constitutionally traumatic event to render it impossible.

    So Trump could commit murder and not be charged? Just like Louis the 14th?

  52. Well he could. Just not while he is President. So upon being impeached and convicted he could then be indicted for murder.

  53. Pat’s in love with the guy.

    That’s why the endless barrage of legalistic hogwash.

  54. because Paul of the motivation.

    There is no evidence of wrong doing, there is no criminal act that has been committed that anyone is aware of.

    How our system works is for the local, state, and federal governments can invade your private papers there has to be a crime and there must be reasonable suspicion.

    The Private Citizen is ABOVE ALL Government in this country. Trump was a private citizen during the time periods that they want to look. They have no evidence or reasonable suspicion that any illegal activity has occurred. The Government therefore under the 4th and 5th Amendments have zero right to view those records.

    If they are allowed to view a Presidents records without Just Cause and Due Process what is there to protect me?

  55. I’m in Love with this thing called LIBERTY Phantom.

  56. “How our system works is for the local, state, and federal governments can invade your private papers there has to be a crime and there must be reasonable suspicion.”

    The two prong test in Smith v. Maryland for determining whether a search has occurred for purposes of the fourth amendment are as follows:

    1. the person “has exhibited an actual expectation of privacy”; and
    2. society is prepared to recognize that this expectation is reasonable.

    These aren’t his private papers. These are papers that Donald Trump has given to the federal government. As such he has no reasonable expectation of privacy. As such the fourth amendment doesn’t apply.

  57. Seamus you’re wrong. They are his private papers.

  58. They aren’t. The IRS have them.

  59. New York State / City has virtually identical information also.

    Both the State and City have income taxes here, with both based on the federal returns of a person or business.

  60. two prong test for a cop.

    Has a crime been committed and is this guy likely to be involved.

    No crime… No cops…. local, state, or federal.

    There is no crime here and it’s unconstitutional for the government to seize your property without probable cause to look for one.

  61. The Congress isn’t a police agency.

    They have oversight powers.

  62. “There is no crime here and it’s unconstitutional for the government to seize your property without probable cause to look for one.”

    It isn’t his property. It is the property of the IRS. They have it, not him.

    “two prong test for a cop.”

    The two prong test is established by the United States Supreme Court, not the Patrick Van Roy I’m Losing An Argument So I Pull Nonsense Out Of My Ass Court. The PVRILAASIPNOOMAC two prong test is irrelevant. The SCOTUS two prong test is:

    1. the person “has exhibited an actual expectation of privacy”; and
    2. society is prepared to recognize that this expectation is reasonable.

    And Trump has turned this information over to the Federal Government. Thus he cannot have an actual expectation that the Federal Government isn’t going to look at it.

  63. Because Paul of the motivation.

    There is no evidence of wrong doing, there is no criminal act that has been committed that anyone is aware of.

    How our system works is for the local, state, and federal governments can invade your private papers there has to be a crime and there must be reasonable suspicion.

    Yet again Pat we’re not talking about criminal procedure we’re talking about Presidential custom & tradition. Why would Trump break Presidential custom & tradition if there’s nothing to hide?

    Once again I state that as far as we know no crimes have been committed and that Trump isn’t obliged by law to disclose his tax returns but his unwillingness to do so, (e.g. being under ‘audit’ since his election), would suggest that there is something that he wants to obscure from public view?

    After all, as Pete says above: If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear, right?

  64. They have oversight powers.

    They do, they can go through every record of every detail of his life from the moment he took office. That’s oversight.

    Not before, not without a crime. That’s unconstitutional and it’s fishing, not oversight.

  65. The thread has been successfully diverted from Trump releasing all documents relating to the absence of Russian meddling to the Trump tax situation. Then again, Trump has diverted from the non-Wall to disclosure. Meanwhile, population replacement continues with or without the diversions…….

    https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/05/14/survey-only-2-in-15-americans-aware-of-soaring-illegal-immigration-to-u-s/

    Less than two-in-15 American voters are aware of the soaring levels of illegal immigration across the United States-Mexico border, a new survey finds.

    The latest Harvard/Harris Poll reveals that when Americans are asked how many illegal aliens are arriving at the U.S.-Mexico border, only about 13 percent answer correctly. Meanwhile, about 76 percent of Americans believe illegal immigration levels are vastly lower than they actually are.

    For example, there were nearly 100,000 border apprehensions in April, alone. This puts illegal immigration at the southern border on track to outpace every year of illegal immigration under former President Obama and take the U.S. back to Bush era levels. At current rates, experts project there to be 863,000 border apprehensions this Fiscal Year, though this only counts illegal aliens who are caught at the border and does not include those who successfully cross.

    There are millions of brown invaders loose within the US, and it is Trump’s fault….

    Americas Merkel The Great Fusilli • 10 days ago

    .

    Donald Trump in 2016 trying to get our vote:

    “DACA ends on Day One!”

    Donald Trump a few months after being elected with our votes:

    “But the DACA situation is a very, very — it’s a very difficult thing for me. Because, you know, I love these kids.” Donald Trump post election.

    Ann Coulter
    ‏Verified account @AnnCoulter

    Coulter’s Quiz: Trump has promised (again!) to close the border. Will he do that before or after he signs the executive order on anchor babies?

    Coulter’s Quiz No. 2: Trump has promised (again!) to close the border. Will he do that before or after he appoints Kobach head of Homeland Security?

    Coulter’s Quiz No. 3: Trump has promised (again!) to close the border. Will he do that before or after he deports illegal alien “Dreamers”?

    Coulter’s Quiz No. 4: Trump has promised (again!) to close the border. Will he do that before or after he builds the wall?

    Coulter’s Quiz No. 5: Trump has promised (again!) to close the border. Will he do that before or after his administration arrests the mayors of sanctuary cities?

  66. Not before, not without a crime. That’s unconstitutional and it’s fishing, not oversight.

    Still hiding behind criminal procedure?

    Yet again Pat we’re not talking about criminal procedure we’re talking about Presidential custom & tradition. Why would Trump break Presidential custom & tradition if there’s nothing to hide?

  67. None of these guys have given one good reason why the Crime Don Has broken with a half century of precedent and good practice

    Because there is no – good – reason

  68. The ONLY TRADITION that matters in this country Paul is ALL EQUAL UNDER THE LAW, Still hiding behind criminal procedure?

    The true power, power over people sits in criminal procedure.

  69. We should make it a Law…. if it’s not a choice it’s compelled by Law.

    I am 100% behind a forensic audit of every elected officials entire life and that of their families. I’ll vote yes for that Law right now.

  70. Trump and Barr want to expose CIA and FBI secrets to the world.

    Just what Boss Putin wants.

  71. you’re smarter than that

  72. The ONLY TRADITION that matters in this country Paul is ALL EQUAL UNDER THE LAW

    I’ll remember that the next time you speak about Christmas, Thanksgiving, the 4th of July etc.

    Let me once again state that I’m not speaking about legal proceedings but well established, long standing Presidential protocol. Donnie is under absolutely no legal obligation to forward his tax returns and not doing so is not a crime.

    I strongly suspect that there’s something in Trump’s finances that he’s trying to obscure from public view and that’s the reason for this breaking with firmly established Presidential custom. I don’t know if it’s criminal but suspect that it’s deeply unethical.

    You are using unrelated legalese and trying to portray this as a criminal procedural matter as a fig leaf in justifying Trup’s avoidance of the issue. I know it, you know it and everyone reading this blog knows it.

  73. That was an entertaining thread.