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MARK FIELD IS INNOCENT

By Pete Moore On June 21st, 2019

Never have we witnessed such a parade of pearl-clutching snowflakery.

To the Mansion House last night, where the Chancellor was giving the annual address to City bigwigs. It’s a VIP only event. A kerfuffle breaks out while Hammond is droning on. Eco-commies are in the house. They blast alarms and shout crazy things. Mark Field, a Foreign Office minister, spies a spinster heading determinedly for the podium. He acts in the moment, stops her, turns her and sends her packing to feed her cats. He does this instantly and efficiently in an age when political violence is an acknowledged problem.

Cue a total Loony Left meltdown all day. It’s such a meltdown that the Left has overturned decades of cultural Marxist dogma. We’ve been lectured for decades that women and men are no different. That women are tough! That this girl can! That men and women must – absolutely must – be treated the very same! Women can take it, they are not the weaker sex! But do you hear that beeping? That’s the commie bus backing up.

All of a sudden it’s “Oh he’s assaulting her. She’s a lady. She’s weak and small and he’s such a brute. She’s a lady. Oh crivens this is so terrible. Won’t anyone help that small, weak, helpless lady?” That has been left twitter and the media all day. And it’s bullshit of course.

Mark Field did the right thing. She might have had a knife in her bag, maybe a jar of acid, maybe something else. Act first, defuse the threat, discuss the details later. However, amid the lefty meltdown, I welcome the left’s small step back to reality. Yes, women are the fairer sex.

147 Responses to “MARK FIELD IS INNOCENT”

  1. So throwing milkshake over someone is a violent assault and an act of political oppression. Battering a woman to stop her making a political point at an event where you don’t want her is now fine and dandy.

  2. “Battering” doesn’t mean what you think it means.

  3. Was she at a private event?

    Was she authorized to be there?

    How was she battered?

  4. Phantom –

    They trespassed at an invite-only event. The Chancellor, other politicians and City chaps were there. Like the Treasury Secretary meeting Wall Street.

    Commies are outraged today that you can’t just walk in and go up to the Chancellor at the podium.

  5. Anyone who disrupts a private event deserves a decisive heave-ho.

    Who here disputes that?

  6. Grabbing a woman by the throat – ✔

    Throwing a milkshake over someone – X

    I suspect had she defended herself and buried her head in his face we would be seeing very different Pete propaganda.

  7. “How was she battered?”

    Throwing a woman into a wall and then grabbing her by the back of the neck is kosher now?

  8. ““Battering” doesn’t mean what you think it means.”

    You may want to look up the definition of battery Pete.

  9. Paul –

    She instigated it. They invaded the venue in an age of political violence. Mark Field was perfectly proper.

    If she is ever accosted by an aggressor and responds by putting the nut on him then I’ll congratulate her.

  10. It was a peaceful protest and she was attacked by Field. There were police at the event. The Chancellor was speaking. As such his personal protection officers would have been in place. They did not feel the need to intervene with that level of force. So considering that specialist protection police officers didn’t feel the need to do so there clearly was no threat.

  11. They invaded the venue in an age of political violence.

    The right of freedom of speech only goes so far then?

    I’ll congratulate her

    No. I someone don’t think tha would have been the case had things been different.

  12. The right of freedom of speech only goes so far then?

    Everyone has the right to free speech. No-one has the right to an audience.

    Paul, I’m on the record here as supporting the right of women to be armed and to shoot aggressors. Your record defends a mother of ten being abducted, tortured and shot in the head while being somewhat soft about the jihad-rape of thousands of British girls.

    I’m not a vindictive man, so I’ll lock the record draw now.

  13. “I genuinely believed, how ever daft and stupid that belief may be, that Nigel Farage was going to attack me. So I threw a milkshake at him to deter him”. Seems reasonable?

  14. The usual suspects here seem to always be fine with disrupting ” deplorable ” ( to them ) political gatherings. There’s never any criticism of the practice.

    Now, even in private settings.

    I’m not so sure that they’d be so permissive if their adversaries disrupted their own gatherings.

    The wrong disrupters would be fascists, the right disrupters are the good guys.

  15. Because in my opinion when two wrong things occur you reserve the bulk of the criticism for the more serious of the two. Which is more unacceptable? A group of protesters disrupt someone’s speech or a Foreign Office Minister batters a woman?

  16. As Seamus says, this was a totally peaceful protest which had gone on for several minutes before the assault. But predictably it has got caught up in our culture war. Which means that the cause determines the reaction on both sides and there is no dispassionate attempt to analyse the reasonableness of either the protest or the reaction to it. Most Rightists like Pete have rushed to justify the assault and most Leftists have condemned it, even though many of them gloated when Farage was milk-shaked:

    “Last night climate change demonstrators got into the Mansion House banquet. Conservative MP and Foreign Office minister Mark Field responded by grabbing a woman by the throat, forcing her against a pillar and then marching her out the room. There was no particular reason to think this person posed a physical threat, but even if you believe that is what motivated Field, he must be able to demonstrate it on the basis of behaviour which is certainly not visible in the footage released online.

    If identities were reversed, the discussion would have gone a different way. When Nigel Farage had a milkshake thrown at him recently, his supporters treated it as a moment of mortal danger. But the woman last night was not Farage – prominent, powerful, male, on the right. She was female, a protester, unheard of. So the response was completely different…

    Everything has to be part of the culture war. There can be no moment of shared values, no moment in which people say that they are outraged by the behaviour even if they do not sympathise with the victim’s politics. This is not a flaw in the system. It is the system. It is a function of the culture war. It demands that the identity of the person dictates your moral reaction to what has happened. There is no equality of status, no comprehension that people are ends instead of means. The throwing of a milkshake over a man is worse than the grabbing of a woman by the throat because they stand in different positions on the culture war…”

    https://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2019/06/21/week-in-review-justifying-attacks-on-women-for-the-culture-w

  17. The more serious wrong was the initial wrong , without which the evening would have passed calmly.

    The action of the troublemakers was the proximate cause of all of it.

    Let all law abiding people gather peaceably, esp behind closed doors.

    You guys absolutely don’t support this most basic principle.

  18. Here is an eye-witness account, from someone on the Right:

    “On and on it went: the women kept shouting and refused to leave. After a while, the Lord Mayor stood up and very politely said that the women had made their point, so could they now go? But they just carried on. It went on so long the audience were getting visibly fed up and agitated, and started heckling the protestors to go. I sat there literally a couple of metres away thinking how astonishingly restrained it was: surrounded by cameras, both professional TV and smart phones, the men in black blocking the women in red were clearly desperately trying not to use any force.

    I did not see Mark Field, who was the other side of a column, so cannot comment. The women were not just protestors but illegal trespassers in the home of the Lord Mayor – but if they refuse to leave, what can be done without force? Really not much. I also thought it was peculiarly British, and not just because of the black ties and ball gowns – I think in many other countries it would have ended in fighting.

    Eventually the protestors did dissipate, as they themselves probably got bored of shouting and were no doubt surprised how long it went on, as the men in black – many of whom probably played rugby – formed into rows pushing the women back out of the room. The protest over, the Chancellor stood up, and said that the irony was they were protesting against the government that is leading the world with its pledge to be carbon neutral by 2050. The audience, relieved it was all over, erupted in cheers.”

    https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2019/06/my-night-at-the-mansion-house-climate-protest/

  19. A certain element in our lands don’t want to allow their opponents to speak or meet at all.

    This is to be condemned.

  20. She should have been removed for having a bra strap showing at a black tie event.

  21. Everyone has the right to free speech. No-one has the right to an audience.

    It was a peaceful non disruptive protest. She even told him it was a peaceful protest.

    Your record defends a mother of ten being abducted, tortured and shot in the head

    I don’t think I’ve ever defended the murder of Jean McConville?

    The usual suspects here seem to always be fine with disrupting ” deplorable ” ( to them ) political gatherings.

    Hey Phantom, fuck you and fuck your ‘usual suspects’ cowardice. There was no ‘disruption’ She was standing there draped in a climate change sash.

    Stop making excuses for women beaters.

  22. Phantom

    I suspect that if the women had been Brexit supporters Pete Moore’s reaction would have been quite different. That’s the poison of the culture wars. They cause double-standards to be applied.

  23. “A certain element in our lands don’t want to allow their opponents to speak or meet at all.”

    And a certain element think it is okay to batter women. That is to be condemned with far greater rigour.

  24. Most Rightists like Pete have rushed to justify the assault ..

    By any measure I’m a moderate centrist, and there was no assault.

  25. Always, always on the side of thugs who bust up meetings with noise and or fists

    Brownshirt tactics are always bad.

  26. “Always, always on the side of thugs who bust up meetings with noise and or fists”

    Only one person engaged in physical violence. Only one. Not the protesters but thug Field. Why are you defending women batterers?

  27. Always, always on the side of thugs who bust up meetings with noise and or fists

    This woman didn’t ‘bust up’ anything or use noise or fists. It was a peaceful protest. She told Mark Fields it was a peaceful protest

    Stop excusing women beaters.

  28. Good thing she wasn’t at a Trump rally, or you boys might have a case.

  29. I wonder would Field have been such a big man had the protester been an averagely sized, averagely built male?

  30. there was no assault

    LOL. To her credit the victim will not press charges and has suggested that Field should attend an anger management course.

  31. if the women had been Brexit supporters Pete Moore’s reaction would have been quite different.

    Yes or no Pete?

  32. Now that, Paul, is a good question.

  33. I’m sure that the Sinn Phonies and Basquers would never evict someone who busted up one of their ceremonies/meetings

  34. There have been plenty of protests against Sinn Féin in the last decade (especially over the abortion issue). I don’t recall a TD, MP, MLA etc… from Sinn Féin ever assaulting one of the protesters.

  35. Straw man alert in attempting to excuse a woman beater.

  36. “I’m sure that the Sinn Phonies and Basquers would never evict someone who busted up one of their ceremonies/meetings”

    And he didn’t evict her. He attacked her.

  37. Who is referring to protests?

    Do Sinners welcome people shouting down their speakers, or intimidating them off the streets?

    They’re perfectly OK with that?

  38. “Do Sinners welcome people shouting down their speakers, or intimidating them off the streets?”

    I have no idea. You will have to ask them. Have you any evidence that they respond to protesters by brutalising them?

  39. “Who is referring to protests?”

    This was a protest. So we are all referring to protests.

  40. Straw man alert in attempt to save face for defending woman beating coward.

  41. This was a disruption of a private meeting.

    I don’t think that anyone would dare to disrupt a Shinner private meeting.

  42. “I don’t think that anyone would dare to disrupt a Shinner private meeting.”

    I’m sure it has happened. As I said Sinn Féin have been targeted for protests since the shift in abortion policy. And if a protester was to disrupt a Sinn Féin meeting and a Sinn Féin TD, MP, or MLA was to batter one of the peaceful female protesters then I would be as quick to condemn them as I have been to condemn Field.

  43. She was standing there wearing a climate change sash. She told him it was a peaceful protest.

    Stop defending cowardly women beaters.

  44. But we can’t think of examples where it has happened at a SF rally.

    We can think of a number of cases where UK conservative or US Trump rallies have been infiltrated and disrupted.

    And in some of these cases ( Trump ) the infiltrators subsequently sought to rush the stage. ( Chicago I think )Which is why you don’t play around with intruders.

  45. “But we can’t think of examples where it has happened at a SF rally.”

    I can’t think of an example were a Sinn Féin TD, MP, or MLA attacked a peaceful protest. I can think of examples were they have been protested.

    “We can think of a number of cases where UK conservative or US Trump rallies have been infiltrated and disrupted.”

    I seem to remember a few weeks ago at an anti-Trump rally in London a Trump supporter decided to wade into the middle of it and disrupt it. He then had milkshake thrown over him. You seemed ok with his disruption and wanted criminal charges brought against the person who threw the milkshake.

    “And in some of these cases ( Trump ) the infiltrators subsequently sought to rush the stage. ( Chicago I think )Which is why you don’t play around with intruders.”

    Which is why there are security professionals there to deal with it. Not cowboy wannabes. And this protester wasn’t rushing the stage.

  46. Staging a disruption at a media conference or event – as Austin Stack, whose father was murdered by the IRA, did during a press conference featuring Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams on Thursday – is a potent and effective tactic for those who oppose the message to get their own message across

    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/when-protesters-set-the-stage-at-media-events-1.2898522

    I’m sure if Austin Stack had been assaulted by SF elected representative for the disruption we’d have heard about it?

    Now please stop trying to cover yourself for excusing a woman beating coward.

  47. I seem to remember a few weeks ago at an anti-Trump rally in London a Trump supporter decided to wade into the middle of it and disrupt it.

    He was standing in the street, not invading a private space. When a Trump supporter invites himself into the Clinton kitchen I’ll join you in condemning it.

    She was standing there wearing a climate change sash. She told him it was a peaceful protest.

    Ah right. That’s it. Attackers always shout that they’re about to attack someone just before doing it. Now we know the signs to look for.

  48. “He was standing in the street, not invading a private space.”

    So? Disruption is disruption. It also wasn’t Mark Field’s private space. If the Lord Mayor of London wanted them removed I’m sure he could have arranged it.

  49. A private space is very different from a public street.

    We need to teach this?

  50. It wasn’t his private space. He was not there in his capacity as a private citizen.

  51. “We need to teach this?”

    What hypocrisy? And changing narratives to suit your objectives? Yeah you probably do need to teach that.

  52. Though I see the Tories violence against women problem isn’t getting any better. Police were called tonight to Boris Johnson’s flat in a possible domestic violence issue.

  53. I wonder would Field have been such a big man had the protester been an averagely sized, averagely built male?

    Somehow I doubt that. The craven, yellow, woman beating bastard.

    A private space is very different from a public street

    Staging a disruption at a media conference or event – as Austin Stack, whose father was murdered by the IRA, did during a press conference featuring Sinn Féin leader Gerry Adams on Thursday

    Press conferances usually aren’t held in public streets?

  54. The usual usuals are really on message today.

  55. “The usual usuals are really on message today.”

    Why is it ok for a Trump troll to disrupt a liberal gathering but it isn’t ok for climate change protesters to disrupt a conservative gathering?

  56. So you don’t like the example where SF didn’t beat up the guy who disrupted Gerry Adams’ press conference then?

    Okay, carry on excusing the gutless woman beater.

  57. Paul, you’re condemnations in this case detract from the very real problem of violence against women, in my humble opinion.

  58. Did he beat her or just bustle her off ?

    From what I saw, it was little more than the push and shove you’d see in a club when the bouncers get heavy around closing time. At any rate, it made the protest headline news, which is surely what she wanted.

    These kind of protests are really just moral exhibitionism, no matter how worthy the cause.

    She was doing her best to disrupt a private event. Attacking someone walking peacefully down a street or when simply talking to others in a public space is a totally different matter.

  59. Noel, your perspective is a breath of fresh air.

  60. How do you reach the conclusion that my condemnation of a man physically assaulting a woman detracts from the problems of violence against woman Charles?

    She was doing her best to disrupt a private event.

    From what I’ve viewed so far Noel she was standing there wearing an anti climate change sash.

  61. Paul, because you are characterizing what happened as a “beating” which it clearly wasn’t. I don’t think even the word “assault” is appropriate, but must express my lack of knowledge on the legal definition.

  62. I think I’ve accused the coward in question of being a woman beater, a common enough term for someone who physically assaults a woman. Would you prefer I change it to woman abuser / assaulter?

  63. I don’t think even the word “assault” is appropriate

    Actually, in legal terms the term ‘battery’ is probably the most appropriate.

  64. I’m not sure what the proper term is. Since he touched her he may be an assaulter. But I agree with Noel that Field looks more like a bouncer giving someone the bum’s rush.

    The woman in question isn’t even filing charges to my knowledge, saying he needs “anger management.”

  65. Battery it is. That’s all I’m saying mate, to keep some legal perspective on the issue.

  66. //a woman beater//
    That’s hardly an appropriate term. He came to grips with the person who stormed into the event. I don’t doubt he’d have acted any differently if it were a man.

    //From what I’ve viewed so far Noel she was standing there//

    For God’s sake, Paul. She wasn’t just “standing” anywhere. She barged into the event and made straight for the speaker as quickly as she could. The man also didn’t beat or assault her, as you claim. Don’t tell me you didn’t see the footage. Here it is again (scroll)

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-48718725

  67. That the woman isn’t pressing charges shows her magnanimity. Field may look like a bouncer but he isn’t and certainly had no call putting his hands on that woman.

  68. Charles, as always, is the Voice of Reason. About visible bra straps too.

    Decorum is everything.

  69. “Charles, as always, is the Voice of Reason. About visible bra straps too.”

    Charles: Battery it is.

    Pete: “Battering” doesn’t mean what you think it means.

  70. My work here is done!

  71. She barged into the event and made straight for the speaker as quickly as she could.

    You must be watching a different video from me Noel.

    The man also didn’t beat or assault her, as you claim.

    Absolutely he did, he grabs he by the neck and pushes her up against a column. Let me tell you this, were any fella to not assault me in the same manner he’d end up with a very sore face.

  72. These guys like it when their buddies do bad stuff.

    When Trump or Boris people do it, it’s really terrible however.

  73. Not really Phantom. I’m just not overly fond of cowardly men physically assaulting women. You on the other hand seem to be excusing and justifying it.

  74. I saw the footage and Field simply turned the protestor around and directed her out: only those with strong out-group preference saw an assault. Interesting though is the reaction against Field by the government. Perhaps now it shall be established by precedence i.e. by this incident, that whenever an intruder is heading towards a government minister, don’t intervene – let it happen.

  75. You are very Philadelphian today, reading things that were never said.

    You on the other hand have a track record of justifying disruption or explaining away assaults on peaceful demonstrators ( Pegida, Dublin )

  76. You on the other hand have a track record of justifying disruption or explaining away assaults on peaceful demonstrators

    Only those with whom he disagrees. There’s freedom of speech that Paul supports, but only for speech that Paul supports

  77. Yes, this is dangerous thinking.

    He repeatedly explained away the real violence committed against Pegida, while now pretending to be horrified at the ” battering “.

    The highly partisan are moral when it is to their political advantage to do so.

  78. Reading things that were never said

    Oh don’t talk spheres. Have a quick look over some of your comments about and your excusing and justification of the assault is quite evident.

    I’ve told you before lads, when some Polish guy says fuck you and fuck your communism to a Dub in their own city someone’s liable to finish with a sore jaw.

  79. I’ve told you before lads, when some Polish guy says fuck you and fuck your communism to a Dub in their own city someone’s liable to finish with a sore jaw.

    Yes, the Irish are instinctively violent toward any criticism, particularly from foreigners. Tell us something we don’t know.

  80. Yes Pete, whatever you say.

    Those North Dublin boys are tough kiddies. You wouldn’t want to go around insulting them.

  81. Yes, that was justifying the physical violence that the perps traveled from outside the area to commit, that they said very openly in advance of the Pegida assembly that they would commit.

  82. I don’t know the story, I haven’t read the post. I know it’s free speech and brawl some faggot hit a girl…. but the girl provoked it… yada yada yada

    Phantom the one thing I know that you understand as well as I do without offense… these foreigners just don’t get Free Speech. The basic concept is just to alien to them.

    That being said thank you I totally love this insult you pay me high compliment. Thank you I love it

    Phantom, on June 21st, 2019 at 11:47 PM Said:
    You are very Philadelphian today, reading things that were never said.

  83. The left part of the political spectrum in Europe is all for free speech, for themselves and all their little friends. They’re very consistent in that.

  84. yeah and stomp everyone else into the dirt…..

    Everyone must be allowed to speak their hearts piece openly whether anyone else likes it or agrees with it or not

    that’s worth fighting to the death for.

  85. Well, they didn’t travel quite as far as Identity Ireland, (Polish Division), did to provoke it. It’s amusing how you justify and excuse the phsical assault of a woman on one hand yet get awfully shirty when a group of central Europeans insult a crowd of Dubs in their own city and get chased down a street for it.

  86. Your allies are ” provoked ” by anyone that disagrees with them.

  87. Well, as said, when some guy says fuck you and fuck your communism to a Dub in their own city be it on their own heads.

    You can’t really insult people and then cry about it. Still, as long as it gets you off the hook for excusing physical abuse of women, eh?

  88. How did the woman get into the place? Did they not have security at the door only admitting people who were invited? If the woman was turned away without entrance this incidence would not have occurred.

  89. I have not seen the incident so cannot comment on the specifics. But in this age of throwing things at politician and so soon after the anniversary of the murder of Joe Cox, I am surprised that security was not tighter and wonder how these people gained access to the event ?

    If the lady in question feels she was assaulted then she can resort to making a formal complaint. But I think if you are somewhere where you should not be, and people in the media, supposedly jokingly saying you should throw acid over politicians, then what can one expect ?

  90. Looking at the way he acted and his facial expressions I don’t think was a reaction to fear of a violent or ‘terrorist’ attack. I think he was just angry at this “stupid leftie cow” interupting his cozy elitist dinner and showed a willingness to use more than necessary force to shove the “silly little girl” away. He demonstrated a typically cowardly fake macho display in circumstances where he knew he was under no threat from the woman he was shoving.

  91. Colm – the intruder had no business being there, and there was no more force used than that needed to usher her out. Have you ever been bounced out of a bar before?

    Now, if there were really a need to get at these bankers and their cosy get-together, where’s the IRA when you need it? Oh yes – they’re busily helping the 3rd-world into Ireland, with those same bankers 🙂

    Vote For Change – Sinn Fein really means it!!! Here’s your ‘new Dubs’

    http://www.voteforchange.ie/edmond-lukusa/

  92. Seamus,
    //So throwing milkshake over someone is a violent assault and an act of political oppression. Battering a woman to stop her making a political point at an event where you don’t want her is now fine and dandy.//

    Well said Seamus. You’re using facts logic AND reason against the hypocrite Pete Moore.

  93. Pete Moore,

    //By any measure I’m a moderate centrist, and there was no assault.//

    Your own political compass, which you published on here shows that you’re not a centralist. Were you lying then or are you lying now?

  94. A woman gets aggressively assaulted by a male and Allan justifies this assault?

    Shocked and astounded I am, shocked and astounded I tell ye.

    Where’s the IRA when you need it?

    I’ve told you a few times before, if you wish to travel to Belfast I will facilitate a meeting with you and a number of former IRA prisoners where you can put your questions to them directly and get answers from the horse’s mouth.

    I extend the invitation again although don’t think I’ll be taken up on it as you seem to be as gutless and faux macho as Field, even making excuses to avoid meeting an mild mannered ATW regular in your home city.

  95. Dave

    No it’s not well said at all

    How should she have been removed from this event

    Maybe there should be “ right wing “ Disruptions of private lefty events

    Let’s see how those phonies like it

    NY

    You should not need any security for an event like that. You’re beginning to sound like those guys that think there should be armed guards at schools. In a free country you’re allowed to meet without Expectation of being molested verbally or physically by troublemakers

  96. Phantom
    //I’m sure that the Sinn Phonies and Basquers would never evict someone who busted up one of their ceremonies/meetings//

    A slippery straw man tactic of the kind you usually criticise Patrick for Phantom.

  97. Maybe there should be “ right wing “ Disruptions of private lefty events

    Let’s see how those phonies like it

    What happened to Austin Stack when he disrupted a Gerry Adams press conference?

  98. Dave

    Are you telling me that these guys always like it when people disrupt their private events, And that they just let it go on?

    Perhaps they serve tea and scones to the intruders?

  99. Did this drama queen have a right to be there?

    That is the question

  100. Everyone keeps referring to this as a private event. The venue may have been private but the event wasn’t. It is an annual political event televised live in British TV attended by those who rule us. These sorts of peaceful but direct protest are a robust part of a politically healthy culture and yes the people taking part can and should expect to be robustly handled, that’s part of the ‘theatre’ of it all. No great crime was committed here by anyone but he seemed to take a particularly spiteful and unnecessarily aggressive attitude towards the protester.

  101. Phantom,
    //Dave

    No it’s not well said at all

    How should she have been removed from this event//

    Now calm down Phantom and reread what I said. I never said anything about how she was removed from the event. I was agreeing with cmas when he was pointing out Pete Moore’s hypocrisy yet again.

    Let’s make my opinion on this clear to you so there’s no confusion. I don’t believe the woman was violently assaulted, but I believe that more force was used than was necessary.

    //Maybe there should be “ right wing “ Disruptions of private lefty events

    Let’s see how those phonies like it//

    In my opinion you don’t have the right to protest private events whether they left or right is that clear enough for you?

  102. Are you telling me that these guys always like it when people disrupt their private events, And that they just let it go on?

    Yet again,

    What happened to Austin Stack when he disrupted a Gerry Adams press conference?

    A slippery straw man tactic of the kind you usually criticise Patrick for Phantom.

    Absolutely Dave. And a seemingly incorrect straw man at that.

  103. He seemed to take a particularly spiteful and unnecessarily aggressive attitude towards the protester

    I’d bet pounds to pennies Colm that he would have taken a very, very different approach had the protester been an averagely tall, averagely built male.

  104. Colm and Paul.

    I agree. Watching the video where he grabbed the woman, he does look like a c**t.

  105. Question:

    What should have happened to the woman if after Field aggressively manhandling her she had done something like knee him in the balls?

  106. Dave

    I’m an innocent lad. I am not sure what that last word you typed was 😉

  107. Judging by the slavish admiration shown by the Cons to Boris Colm it may have been cult.

  108. “Phantom the one thing I know that you understand as well as I do without offense… these foreigners just don’t get Free Speech. The basic concept is just to alien to them.”

    So says the nation of Joe McCarthy.

  109. Colm.
    //Dave

    I’m an innocent lad. I am not sure what that last word you typed was //

    It was Clot mate. As in a foolish person. 😁

  110. Dave

    That’s that’s clear , thank you

    Seamus

    So says the nation of Joe McCarthy

    That’s an exceptionally weak comment, from .Someone who is often the best commenter here

    Are you from the nation Of the Kingsmill massacre? You want that put in your face every day? Then cut it out

    Free speech Means different things in America and in England. Your laws on the matter are different than ours are

    Support for free political speech and assembly is interpreted differently as well, esp among the young and lefty.

    This is a proper topic of discussion

    – Before – the Pegida incident in Dublin, “ antifa “ dregs said in writing that the Pegida demo would be blocked by physical force. There was talk in writing of beating the Pegida guys up. There were links to those comments put up on ATW before the demo even happened. Exactly none of that violence was spontaneous or in reaction to any provocation. It was planned, and everybody here knows it

    .

  111. Exactly none of that violence was spontaneous or in reaction to any provocation

    As Seamus said above, ‘changing narratives to suit your objectives’

    We’ve now established:

    It wasn’t a private matter
    It was an absolutely peaceful protest
    Nothing happens to people that disrupt SF press conferences.

    So, now that you’ve run out of excuses in trying to save face for defending the aggressive physical assault of a woman you’re now trying to blame it on something Petr wrote on ATW?

    Look, those central European thugs Identity Ireland, (Polish Division), verbally insulted Dubliners in Dublin. You excusing and jutifying the aggressive physical assault of a woman while pissing your pants about a crowd of yobs being chased down a street in Dublin after insulting the natives would suggest to me that you’ve got your priorities arse about face.

  112. “That’s an exceptionally weak comment, from .Someone who is often the best commenter here

    Are you from the nation Of the Kingsmill massacre? You want that put in your face every day? Then cut it out

    Free speech Means different things in America and in England. Your laws on the matter are different than ours are

    Support for free political speech and assembly is interpreted differently as well, esp among the young and lefty.”

    So say it then. Say free speech is sometimes interpreted in different ways around the planet. Don’t pretend that America has free speech and everywhere else doesn’t. My comment was a response to the American exceptionalism bollocks that seems to be ingrained in most American commentators.

    If America was the free speech nirvana that it is made out to be then it wouldn’t have been the nation of Joe McCarthy. Unless you are suggesting that America’s free speech is a relatively modern phenomenon that exists now but didn’t exist in the 1950s.

    Free speech in its purest form doesn’t exist and shouldn’t exist (unless you support legalising child pornography for example). The arguments is over what limits are acceptable and what limits are not. And in fact you, by saying that protesters should be violently removed, are putting limits on the speech of those protesters. So stop pretending that you support free speech and the “young and lefty” don’t. The same argument you are making about them “free speech in certain circumstances” can also be applied to you, me, Paul and everyone else on here.

  113. McCarthy wasn’t condemning free speech he was huntin commie pinko bastards and he found a lot of them…. and they destroyed him for it and he drank himself to death…..

  114. Good post Seamus.

  115. “McCarthy wasn’t condemning free speech he was huntin commie pinko bastards and he found a lot of them…. and they destroyed him for it and he drank himself to death…..”

    Hunting people for their speech is an attack on free speech.

    “Good post Seamus.”

    Cheers Dave.

  116. Patrick Van Roy,
    //McCarthy wasn’t condemning free speech he was huntin commie pinko bastards and he found a lot of them….//

    No offence Patrick but this could only makes sense in your head. A lot of these people had their lives destroyed and worse for simply believing in a different political system.

  117. He was huntin commie pinko bastards

    Why were they ‘bastards’ Pat? Because they had a different perspective to you?

    I don’t see how anyone who profuses to believe in the Bible can reject the notion of communal sharing.

  118. now it was an anti ACTIVITIES committee not anti speech

  119. So if someone is attacked for wearing a “Make America Great Again” hat then would that be anti-hat and not anti-speech? Stop playing the fool. You know that speech includes non-verbal political ideas as well. And that political oppression of a group of people because they have different political ideas is an attack on free speech.

  120. The venona papers vindicated McCarthy but once again facts don’t matter all that matters is the spin.

    Never Print the truth when the legend is so much juicer.

  121. The weren’t just bastards they were no good commie bastards….. the most vile creature to infest mankind responsible for more death pain and suffering than any other philosophy in human history…… you mean that evil different perspective

  122. “The venona papers vindicated McCarthy but once again facts don’t matter all that matters is the spin.”

    No they didn’t. Of the 159 targeted by Joe McCarthy the Venona project papers found that 9 of them had aided Soviet espionage efforts.

  123. //Are you from the nation Of the Kingsmill massacre? //

    Phantom, please tell me you aren’t being serious with that comparision.

    McCarthy was an elected public representative, a senator, and was acting on foot of an executive order signed by the President no less, and he hauled people before government panels.

    And you think the people who made Kingsmill are similar in relation to the Irish state.

  124. I’d also say that if any Irish person says that Irish people are opposed to political violence, that no Irish person would ever engage in political violence, and that Ireland is so different from the rest of the world because of those facts, then please do remind us of Kingsmill.

  125. How if I am saying I will die for the right for anyone to say whatever they damn well choose is that a representation of oppressing anything…..

  126. Patrick Van Roy,
    //now it was an anti ACTIVITIES committee not anti speech//

    but it was antifreeze speech Patrick a lot of these people haven’t done anything other than think differently. In many cases they weren’t even communists in the traditional sense of the word.

    From Wikipedia:
    McCarthyism is the practice of making accusations of subversion or treason without proper regard for evidence.

  127. Would you have died to prevent Joe McCarthy’s witch hunts? Because you seem to be supporting him.

  128. Seamus how infiltrated was FDR’s presidency with commie pinko soviet sympathizing spying bastards….. ?

    Start with Alger Hiss and work backwards.

  129. Of the 159 targeted by Joe McCarthy the Venona project papers found that 9 of them had aided Soviet espionage efforts.

  130. McCarthy was not about speech.

  131. Seamus

    You have said nothing new in that comment. Of course there are few absolute rights. I’ve made that point here a number of times, including when the gun nuts pipe up.

    A surprising number of West Europeans think that is acceptable to bust the heads of those who say things that they don’t approve of. There is a lot less of that in this country.

    Paul clearly agrees with the Criminals who beat up protesters in Dublin. ( in violence that again was announced in advance, including here ) .

    I loathe Trump. But if I saw a Trump supporter being attacked for Wearing a MAGA hat , I’d intervene to protect the Trump supporter. There is no such tradition of defending the rights of strong opponents there. It’s not the same at all

    Your support for speech rights Is measured by how you defend the speech rights of those who you have significant disagreement with. There’s always a line. But Americans have long established a very wide perimeter for protected speech. Nazis Have marched here, with police protection. Communists, who are morally equal to Nazis, have political rights . I have seen the hateful Westboro Baptist Church on the streets of New York. And the days after 911, they were mocking the dead And saying that it was God’s judgment? I Could have hit them if I wanted to. The thought never crossed my mind.

    “ The nation of Joe McCarthy “ does many things horribly ( guns, health care ) , but we Set a good standard on speech, including political speech.

  132. It was. McCarthy attacked people not for being Soviet spies but for being communists. Attacking people for being communists is attacking speech.

  133. ““ The nation of Joe McCarthy “ does many things horribly ( guns, health care ) , but we Set a good standard on speech, including political speech.”

    And yet here you are supporting the battery of a woman who’s speech you don’t approve of.

    ” I Could have hit them if I wanted to. The thought never crossed my mind.”

    It has crossed other people’s minds. Try burning an American flag there. There is a substantial number who want that act to be criminal. And many people have been attacked for doing so.

  134. Joe McCarthy was a thug, a very bad man, a very bad American.

    His attacks on the great General Marshall were particularly disgusting,

  135. I have only now been able to see the video

    I don’t see anybody being beat up or abused

    I see intruders being escorted out

    You guys are actually offended at any of this?

    Holy Jesus

  136. and instead of them saying yeah FU I’m a communist they lied they hid who they were and they turned on each other. And it got dark and it got ugly and McCarthy’s life was destroyed for his part.

    Now Richard Nixon on the other hand was with the house un-americans activities committee at just the right time and left it at just the right time as to not be touched as it crashed and burned.

    America is far from perfect Seamus and still better than anywhere else on our worst day…..

  137. Paul clearly agrees with the Criminals who beat up protesters in Dublin.

    Oh do piss off and stop trying to divert away from the fact you’re excusing, justifying and defending an aggressive woman batterer Phantom. BTW, what you’re trying to imply above is a lie as I’ve told you before:

    Do you think that the Pegida protest should have been allowed to take place without being molested by anyone?

    No, they should have been allowed to protest without physical molestation by anyone

    As a matter of fact, you say a few interesting things about protesters and free speech on that thread:

    Phantom, on February 7th, 2016 at 5:59 PM Said:

    Paul

    I am fine with verbal confrontation

    That isn’t molestation in my books

    If you support the right of people to demonstrate freely, your argument here is not with me. Take it up with the enemies of speech rights.

    My, how things have changed in three years.

  138. Robert F Kennedy Was a strong supporter of Joe McCarthy, And actually worked for him for a time

    World communism, Which was clearly led by Communist USSR at the time, was a great evil, still is a great evil. It’s 90% as bad as Naziism.

    But Joe McCarthy was a bad guy

  139. I don’t see anybody being beat up or abused

    I see a man grabbing a woman by the neck and pushing her against a concrete pillar. Maybe in thinking that’s an aggressive violent assault I just have a different idea of what assault is?

  140. Patrick Van Roy

    //America is far from perfect Seamus and still better than anywhere else on our worst day…..//

    Only in your vivid imagination Patrick. 😁

  141. To the endlessly befuddled Paul

    Attempting to break up a Private assembly is not near mere verbal confrontation

    I hope you enjoyed going back through three years of ATW posts to find that Comment of mine, which was correct and which remains correct,

  142. Finding the comment was worth seeing you hoisted by your own petard.

  143. I’d love to hang around here and watch Phantom continue to try to deflect his defence of an aggressive physical assault on a woman but it’s 33 cels and too good weather not to go out and have some beers.

  144. Paul.

    Bloody hell mate, I thought I started the drinking early. 😁

  145. McCarthy was also godfather to kennedy’s child.

  146. “America is far from perfect Seamus and still better than anywhere else on our worst day…..”

    The sad thing about you Patrick is that you actually probably believe that nonsense.

  147. Those were very different days, so long ago

    It was a bump in the road

    McCarthyism emerged at a time when world communism was still led by the mass murderer Stalin.