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The Voice Speaks

By Patrick Van Roy On May 24th, 2020

Has nothing to do with our regular conversations, but well worth one.

54 Responses to “The Voice Speaks”

  1. Good post

    I know a lot of people who would have been better off had they had gone to trade school or entered an apprenticeship

    A good plumber, electrician, or auto mechanic Is rarely out of work

  2. and they make a good living.

  3. Remember when printer used to be a promising trade, or bookbinder, industrial welder or several trades in the construction sector?

    All gone the way of the cooper, the thatcher and the cartwright. Too many people go to college, yes, but nobody can tell the future.
    Very often in fact the vague-sounding college subjects that people around here like to laugh at are, simply because they are general, the ones that allow most flexibility in a changing job market.

  4. there’s a girl in that video that makes six figures as a welder.

    or did you miss that part…..

  5. Yep, good message and well presented. Going 50K into debt for a degree in Bullshit Studies is a good choice only for the scammer university.

  6. Yes, and an auto mechanic had better take every electric vehicle maintenance course that is offered to him or her

    Because that technology is undergoing exceptionally rapid change

    —-

  7. and the good mechanics at dealerships are getting those courses paid for by GM, FORD, etc

    There is continuing education in every field.

  8. It’s not just the debt

    A lot of people are shoved into college by the family and by society, and the kids just do it because that’s what’s expected of them, they don’t know what else to do

    And they waste two or three or five years Struggling and not learning anything of use.

    This has been discussed here before. The German system of widespread apprenticeships to trade could serve many of our young people well

  9. You always want to add to your toolbox…. no matter what field or profession that toolbox is for.

  10. It would be a good system to adapt and provide an alternative path here.

    Good trade Schools are also very limited. Everyone I know growing up who knew there was no way they we’re going the college root whether because of money, grades, or just attitude would give a body part to get into Williamson Trade School.

    You came out you were guaranteed to do well if not opening your own small trade business being a sought out master by dozens of major construction corporations.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Williamson_College_of_the_Trades

    The School Site
    https://www.williamson.edu/

  11. A friend of mine had the opportunity to join the Navy, and get into the Seabees, The construction battalion, Where they give you a terrific sustained practical training.

    He elected to go to community college instead and take liberal arts courses. He’ll regret it for the rest of his life

    I’ll never understand Why white collar work was came to be seen as being superior to skilled blue-collar work.

    https://www.thebalancecareers.com/overview-of-navy-seabee-careers-2356508

  12. Most of our parents could never go for a million reasons and they had it drilled into them the way up the ladder was college.

    So that’s what our whole generation was geared to as their children.

  13. curiosity although I’m sure most are asleep, but do you across the pond know who Mike Rowe is, and why the post is titled the voice?

  14. I have to share this headline…. I peed myself laughing.

    Bolivian Orchestra Stranded in ‘Haunted’ German Castle Surrounded by Wolves During Pandemic

    https://variety.com/2020/music/news/orchestra-stranded-german-castle-haunted-wolves-coronavirus-bolivia-pandemic-1234615376/

  15. Industrial pipe fitters, electricians and plumbers are never out of work and they make extremely good money. Plus they make money as parenthesises after their first year of school

    Having been in the construction industry for 35 years I might be a little prejudice but If I had a choice of working on a job site or an office I would choose the site every time

  16. “curiosity although I’m sure most are asleep, but do you across the pond know who Mike Rowe is, and why the post is titled the voice?”

    We do get the Discovery Channel here.

    In terms of the broader point it is ultimately it is a supply and demand issue. A lot of these services are still in demand (though in some cases declining) while supply has dropped like a brick because more and more people are going to university and not taking up trades.

    However if more people stopped going to university and started doing trades then (because supply would go up) the wages in those sectors will go down.

    Whether one goes to university or does a trade the key to making substantial money is to have a career where there is plenty demand for your services and not a lot of people who can do it.

  17. //have a career where there is plenty demand for your services and not a lot of people who can do it.//

    Exactly, and as I said, nobody can tell the future.

    A nephew of mine is a qualified joiner and worked many years in the trade.
    But then the construction sector in Ireland hit a slump and he’s now driving a bus.

    Patrick just posted the old truism here. It’s obviously not as simple as that.

  18. There’s an argument to be made regarding following the vocational – academic routes but I can’t help noticing that it seems those arguing strongest for the vocational route are graduates.

    I also have a nephew who’s a joiner in the same position Noel. It also seems to me that joiners are the most common of trades too. If I was going the vocational route I’d try for plumbing, we’re always going to need water where we live.

  19. Paul

    I think its true to say people need water wherever they live 🙂

  20. The average blue collar guy is also a whole lot less likely to be writing OpEds or doing YouTube opinion pieces in the first place than are philanthropists or journalists.

    In real life, I’ve heard white collar people saying that college is key to career to ( all ) economic success way more often than I’ve heard blue collar people say it.

    And politicians, especially Democrat politicians, have very often taken the position that expanded college participation is a -must-.

    I’ve never heard -any- US politician even once say that college can be a bad idea for many, that there can be an alternative route to a job and a life – and education.

  21. //but I can’t help noticing that it seems those arguing strongest for the vocational route are graduates. //

    Yes. Go out and do manual work – Don’t be like me. There’s a lot of the earthy Joe-the-Plumber stuff here.

  22. I’ve worked on sites. It’s physically demanding, tough work but the ones advocating that people persue this path, (and of course, there is an absolute need for such workers), invariably seem to massively be graduates.

    For example, I’d suggest that most if not all those commenting on the issue here have a third level education.

  23. Hate to tell you, But this site is not the world

  24. I think joiner is a steam fitter over here.

    Hey I don’t know what channels you get or don’t….. I know the BBC is a pretty much of a monopoly isn’t it ? and we only officially have had access to “American BBC” for less than ten years and it’s not the same as what you get…..

    Hell I had to watch Dr Who on what we cal pbs the same channel as Sesame Street for 30yrs…

    Besides his own shows “Dirty Jobs” and the others. Mike Rowe is THE Voice Over Voice for everything on Discovery and a ton of other crap…….

    Your right though I have an Ivy School degree, most of us have degrees in something or another. It is however not what it used to be to have a college degree. A good trade school like the one I linked to earlier is a better bet these days and we have far to few of them.

  25. Phantom your 2:02 is on the money….

  26. It is Memorial Day Gentleman I have graves to tend, have a good day everyone……

  27. No one said this site was the world. I said that people advocating for such work tend to overwhelmingly graduates and used this site as a micro example of it.

    A joiner’s a carpenter there Pat, (I think)

  28. I have much admiration for construction workers, particularly on-site in the depths of winter..

    I made an awful mistake of agreeing to work as a ‘labourer’ for a huge building, refit project he took on, it was at Inn on the Park London.

    I lasted three, well, two and half days to be precise.

    It’s hard graft.

    Not for me thanks.

    As they say, you can’t put a pair of overalls on your head.

    😉

  29. I made an awful mistake of agreeing to work as a ‘labourer’ for a huge building, refit project he took on, it was at Inn on the Park London.

    ‘He’ my brother.

  30. Ahh thank you Paul

  31. Patrick

    The BBC For decades was a monopoly, or damned close to it.

    But that’s not the case today

    On over the air radio and TV over there, there are private competitors to the BBC.

    And satellite and cable TV are just as prevalent there and in Ireland and In Europe generally as they are in the United States. If anything, they have even more endless choices than we do in the US.

    This includes a number US news and financial TV stations, as well as English and foreign language versions of continental European, Asian, Arabic, channels, etc

  32. Slightly O/T.

    I wonder if leftworld now thinks Anne Coulter is not so bad after all?

    ‘You complete blithering idiot’: Ann Coulter turns on ‘disloyal actual retard’ Trump in Twitter rant over his criticism of former AG Jeff Sessions
    Coulter was infuriated by after Trump on Saturday told Alabamian’s ‘do not trust Jeff Sessions’ and urged them to instead vote for Tommy Tuberville in the upcoming Senate elections
    Coulter said in response that the president was ‘the most disloyal human God ever created’

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8354535/Ann-Coulter-lashes-disloyal-actual-retard-Donald-Trump-Twitter-rant.html

  33. Trump’s treatment of Sessions is disgraceful. I hope that it backfires

    Sessions respected the law by refusing himself, did not do one thing wrong

  34. Trump is toast.

    He’s done for.

    Oh well, it’s idiot number two then.

  35. //The BBC For decades was a monopoly, or damned close to it. //

    There’s been radio and TV competition for the BBC in the UK as long as I can remember and for a long time before that.

  36. It ain’t over until it’s over, as the great Yogi said.

  37. The election in November won’t resolve anything fundamental. The same 2-party system with the resulting polarisation and mountains of hype about your own side and absurd lies about the other, until the whole idea of objective truth has disappeared, will continue until.., until god knows what it will take to end it.

  38. The BBC had a monopoly on both radio and TV until 1972, very recent days.

    Amazing that this was ever the case in a free country.

    The BBC pretty much did not play rock ‘n’ roll music for a time, Which didn’t exactly make the young people happy, which created an opportunity for pirate radio stations and for radio Luxembourg, Which had a large number of British listeners

    https://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=120358447

  39. Spot on Noel. Whoever wins the election in November polarised Murica will still exist. Trump’s election brought it out into plain sight and now the genie’s not going back into the bottle.

    I do confess that I’d like to see Biden doing it though. Not out of any political differences, as far as I’m concerned they’re the ying – yang two sides of the same coin, I just can’t wait to see the excuses and theories Trump & the cultists come up with for losing.

  40. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_songs_banned_by_the_BBC

  41. I do confess that I’d like to see Biden doing it though. Not out of any political differences, as far as I’m concerned they’re the ying – yang two sides of the same coin, I just can’t wait to see the excuses and theories Trump & the cultists come up with for losing.

    Paul.

    I look forward to the excuses and theories the left come up with, if Biden wins, and nothing, absolutely nothing changes.

    It will simply be business as usual.

  42. Well you’re probably not going to have a crackhead in the White House anymore, one obsessed with endless vendetta and conspiracy theories

    That might be a plus

  43. Trump smokes crack?

    I truly hope Biden does win in November.

    If only for the last remaining remnants of Phantoms sanity.

  44. He doesn’t even drink alcohol,

    Perhaps he should.

    He has the full personality traits of a street crackhead, without having to smoke the stuff.

  45. //The BBC had a monopoly on both radio and TV until 1972, very recent days.//

    No. Independent TV was set up in Britain in the mid 1950’s.

    There were also several pirate radio stations that drew a very large part of the audience – younger listeners – away from the BBC from the early sixties. The great Radio Caroline was set up by Ronan O’Rahilly, grandson of the famous The O’Rahilly who fought and died in the Easter Rising. Ronan called his new station after JKF’s daughter Caroline. He died just last month.

  46. I stand corrected; I read this incorrectly

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/British-Broadcasting-Corporation

    But if this is right they had a monopoly on legal radio broadcasts until 1972, which was completely insane

  47. It will simply be business as usual

    Not out of any political differences, as far as I’m concerned they’re the ying – yang two sides of the same coin

  48. Im old enough to remember when there was only 3 TV channels in the UK, BBC1, BBC2 and ITV. It was only in 1982 that we got our 4th TV Channel, imaginatively called Channel 4. Radio by the 1970s was much more comprehensive in choice. Now if you have a SKY or Virgin TV package you have almost literally several hundred mostly utter crap TV channels to scroll through.

  49. Yes, until I guess the 1970s here a lot of the few TV stations would stop broadcasting at midnight

  50. //Im old enough to remember when there was only 3 TV channels in the UK, BBC1, BBC2 and ITV.//

    Colm, I don’t believe you. Maybe the TV set you guys had at home was such an old banger it couldn’t get Thames Television, Granada, UTV etc. But surely you must have heard your schoolmates talking about them?

  51. Very funny Noel 🙂

  52. Yeah if Creepy Uncle Joe has to bail the murdering St Cuomo will swoop to the rescue and the nation will be saved…….

    The only people smokin crack are you lot….

    Noel the country has always been polarized, it’s only as we developed an homogenous political class did it seem any different.

    The true division in the US has always been between those that want the government in everything and those that want it involved in nothing. With the majority of the population floating comfortably in between.

    It stayed that way for 100yrs slowly shifting till it tipped over in the previous 8, but it had been building to that point for 50yrs. Now the shit is about to hit the fan.

    The real fun is just getting started.

  53. I expect Biden to win but I don’t think the Trumpers are going away. They will still exist out of government and attend Trump rallies for their doses of insanity. There will be still be polarization but the Trumpers will be outside agitators and relatively sane people will restore good government. There has been an angry white uneducated group for decades but with Trump they had an effect on government. That effect will end and they will go back to what they were. Trump the entertainer will play to diminishing crowds but many of his followers will still want a dose of MAGA.

  54. the fact that you can look at Nancy Pelosi, Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler, Stacey Abrams, Chuck Schumer and Joe Biden…. and call that the “SANE” group NYr…. I find quite disturbing…