71 1 min 1 yr

There are a lot of music cities, but Nashville TN is the music city. Walk down Broadway ( yes, that’s what it’s called ) and you see live music in one club after another, some buildings three story affairs with a live band on each floor.

Tonight, the focus will be on a debate between President Trump and Joe Biden.

All US debates of this kind are usually to be avoided, since the participants stick tightly to the script, and rarely answer a question. Mike Pence is the king of this.

President Trump hurt his reelection chances with his bossy, boorish conduct at the first debate. He ducked out of the second one. Let’s see what we get tonight.

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71 thoughts on “Big Debate in Nashville

  1. Trump has sneaked in a guy who is going to make a fuss for him over the Hunter Biden story .
    Wonder how he plans to do that in a closed format . This is not a town hall debate .
    It’s a WWE clash of the septuagenarian titans

  2. He did that same type of thing four years ago, when he brought in women who had accused Bill Clinton of various things.

    This stuff has gotten very old.

    He desperately needs a new playbook, but doesn’t know it. He is the true one trick pony.

  3. Trump will attack Hunter Biden tonight. I predict this will backfire. First, on these storylines, Trump is far down the right wing rabbit hole. Second, voters get that Trump is an emotional bully and a sadist. That’s the prism they’ll see all this through:

  4. Hi Daphers ,
    Omg there’s a women on the site
    Run fascists run .. is her hair covered ?

    Good diagnosis , relief to hear trumps been pegged for the bully he is

  5. Biden could say
    USA needs a president who does more than eat burgers watch TV and rage tweet , in between golf
    He should press Trump on healthcare – saying where is your plan you’ve had 4 years and you got nothin ready
    It’s just another of you lies conning the American people .

  6. My husband of twenty five years and father to our three sons said I should share this with you.

    When I first read that I misread it as husband of five years and I thought, Christ Daphne you been busy!

  7. Nice daphne
    I recognise that voice in the clip just can’t put my finger on it – Sam Elliot ?
    That’s the USA we all want to see again , believed in despite the horrors of Iraq
    The Clinton years of boom , the Obama years of decency and character
    C,mon Joe you’re not alone , can’t wait to see your people in the positions of leadership
    Governing the country and leading by example .
    No crazy firings or indictments and jail time for democrats
    0 0 0 in 8 years of Obama
    Under Trump 100 indictments 40 criminal convictions 12 prison sentences in 4 years
    We’re sick of the sight of you mr trump you dirty sleazebag

  8. Good video Daphne. It went well with my cup of hot chocolate. They both gave me a warm feeling inside. 😁

  9. Numbers are back up to 1k deaths in USA of COVID Charles but trump says we’ve turned the corner
    44 states reporting higher numbers , this thing is gonna blow – alas
    Buy your guy is bored of the news – pandemiced out he said at a rally to cheers from the faithful
    Over here we use the c-word to describe someone like that
    Saves typing and we all know what it means !

  10. Great so we can look at the detail
    Coronavirus – Biden wins as he understands we need to get the R number down and open safely

  11. Impressed with the moderator. She actually brought up Burisma to Biden for his prepared denial. Oh how I wish it was under oath. Trump doing very well, and Biden making few slipups.

  12. As Piers Morgan in England said, even if Biden wins, this money laundering thing is not going away.

  13. Trump talking outa his ass on healthcare , blaming everyone else .
    Trump has no plan for anything whatsoever on any subject and show no understanding of ordinary people’s lives .
    Dividing everyone – he’s a disaster

  14. Objectively, Trump lied a lot
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/10/22/politics/fact-check-final-presidential-election-debate/index.html

    His demeanor was much better. If he acted like this during the first debate, his campaign might be in a bit of a better place.

    I think that few minds were changed last night,

    Biden is wrong in basically blaming trump for all the more than 200,000 Covid deaths. That virus was going to kill many no matter what realistic steps the US took.

    Trump dawdled, misled, and set a bad personal example. That’s criticism enough.

    Biden doesn’t exactly look to have the stamina to serve out eight years , or even four, in that most punishing job

  15. Biden lied as well. For example, he did call Trump xenophobic about cutting off Chinese flights. I’ve seen the tweets.

    I was unimpressed with his Clintonian answer about taking foreign money. “I’ve never taken 1 cent from a foreign government.” Well, how about from a foreign 3rd party through your son?

    I, like Phantom, was very impressed with the professionalism of the moderator, Ms. Welker. She was fair.

  16. Both men did a good job last night.

    Biden looked old, but not feeble or senile, and Trump was very controlled and not bullying.

    Both men made good points, both men delivered their message.

    We couldn’t ask for a better debate to show the contrast of the choice. Do you want the country to follow the religion of Climate Change, or the path of Prosperity.

  17. The influence trading and abuse of the fathers position by Hunter Biden and the reaction or non-reaction or involvement or non-involvement of the father to it is an exceptionally valid issue. But it’s not a new issue. If the other Dems were serious about anything, this would have been a big issue to them one year ago. They’re fine with it this, just as they were fine with the shenanigans of the Clintons.

    The recent deus ex machina laptop eruptions at the last second are just too much to considered. No one knows what we have here.

    The issue is which of these two do you have the most trust in for the next four years, or better still who do you mistrust the least.

  18. “Biden lied as well. For example, he did call Trump xenophobic about cutting off Chinese flights. I’ve seen the tweets.”

    So have I. He did call Trump xenophobic, but not in relation to travel bans, but in relation to Trump in general, and his rhetoric.

    “I was unimpressed with his Clintonian answer about taking foreign money. “I’ve never taken 1 cent from a foreign government.” Well, how about from a foreign 3rd party through your son?”

    That wasn’t a Clintonian answer. Don’t repeat a soundbite of your opponent is rule #1. So don’t even accept the premise that he accepted stuff through third parties via Hunter. To say he didn’t would be to acknowledge the accusation and give it credence.

  19. “Do you want the country to follow the religion of Climate Change, or the path of Prosperity.”

    How about following science on climate change and the path of prosperity? Instead of flat earthers whose anti-science positions caused a worsening response to COVID-19, which then resulted in the biggest collapse of the US economy ever – the drop in GDP in the second quarter was 3 times that of the next worst on record. That is prosperity? Three times as bad as the second worst?

  20. And to be painfully precise, he didn’t stop flights from China when he said he did.

    Nonstop flights from China continued for a long time afterward, maybe they never stopped?

    And as said many times here – much of this virus went from China to north Italy, and came to the US from travelers from Lombardy – via Milan, Rome, Heathrow, you name it. That virus likely came first class on Alitalia to JFK, not on Air China.

    Those flights continued for a long time too. And I don’t criticize Trump for that fact – but note that he is framing multiple parts of virus response wrong.

  21. How about following science on climate change and the path of prosperity?

    Climate Change is not a Science, and following this religions mandates destroys prosperity.

    Instead of flat earthers whose anti-science positions caused a worsening response to COVID-19,

    More propaganda, and it may be the dem platform this election to try and blame the pandemic and it’s results on Trump, but thanks to 5 Democrat Governors and the disasters they caused and are still causing in their states the people blame the dems not Trump for the collapse. The unending riots have been the icing on the cake.

    The day the riots were allowed to continue is the day the dems lost the ability to use covid as an issue to pound on Trump.

  22. For you.

    You’re not the only voter in America.

    Dem mayors have been soft on riots. But we can walk and chew gum at the same time. The botched federal and state and citizen response to Covid is the biggest national issue. But the fish stinks from the head. The mask shirking, Clorox drinking president is the face of the bad government response, the face of the bad example at the top.

  23. “Climate Change is not a Science, and following this religions mandates destroys prosperity.”

    It is science. In fact it is almost universally accepted science with only a few flat earthers, such as yourself, who rejects it. And not prevent climate change will have a far, far more disastrous impact on global prosperity than the cost of preventing it.

    “but thanks to 5 Democrat Governors and the disasters they caused and are still causing in their states the people blame the dems not Trump for the collapse.”

    According to recent polling 73% of New Yorkers approve of Andrew Cuomo’s coronavirus response (with 24% opposed). Similar polling of all Americans show 57% oppose Trump’s coronavirus response, with 40% supporting. So it is clear that ‘the people’ blame the Donald and don’t blame the Democrats.

    You need to look beyond your close circle, bubble boy.

    “The day the riots were allowed to continue is the day the dems lost the ability to use covid as an issue to pound on Trump.”

    Trump was wrong on the riots as well (as most Americans believe).

    “More propaganda”

    Nope. COVID-19 was a national problem, requiring collective national leadership. Trump refused to provide that.

  24. The US result has been very poor as compared with most advanced countries.

    Patrick and the little Patricks here think that no one should take responsibility for that. And that this president is never responsible for any bad thing, ever.

  25. 40,000 dead and over half of the nursing home deaths are all in NY the state that was given everything the needed and failed miserably yet their governor has written a book of how great he did and refuses to take responsibility for sending people to the nursing homes.

    Sorry Phantom once again you’re in the bubble.

  26. “Sorry Phantom once again you’re in the bubble.”

    According to recent polling 73% of New Yorkers approve of Andrew Cuomo’s coronavirus response (with 24% opposed). Similar polling of all Americans show 57% oppose Trump’s coronavirus response, with 40% supporting. So it is clear that ‘the people’ blame the Donald and don’t blame the Democrats.

    Seems like you are the one in the bubble.

  27. It is science. In fact it is almost universally accepted science with only a few flat earthers, such as yourself, who rejects it. And not prevent climate change will have a far, far more disastrous impact on global prosperity than the cost of preventing it.

    The babbling of the brainwashed. A “Science” that does not follow the scientific method is not a science. We can’t prevent or accelerate the cycles of the climate. The climate is controlled by the Earths orbit and the sun. PERIOD.

    Oil is the single greatest factor in prosperity. Mankind can not exist without fossil fuels, let alone prosper.

  28. ” A “Science” that does not follow the scientific method is not a science.”

    It does follow the scientific method. Just because you don’t understand basic science doesn’t mean that it doesn’t follow the scientific method.

    “We can’t prevent or accelerate the cycles of the climate. The climate is controlled by the Earths orbit and the sun.”

    Nonsense. There are many different variables, including the atmposhere. And pumping more and more greenhouse gases into said atmposhere does have a impact on our climate.

    “Oil is the single greatest factor in prosperity. Mankind can not exist without fossil fuels, let alone prosper.”

    Well it can, and increasingly is. The link between CO2 output and economic growth has been broken, which is why many countries are increasing their economic growth while cutting their CO2 output.

  29. I love this term “Flat Earther” it’s calling someone a Heretic because they don’t believe in your religion.

    Unlike you I am very science based, there is nothing I support more. The greatest achievement of mankind is the Space program. That is science. Applying proven mathematical FACTS into the practical applications to place men on the moon, satellites, deep space probes, and all the advances in material development, not to mention the scientific advances in medicine. We are less than a decade away from being able to clone a person their own replacement Liver, Heart, Lungs, etc.

    I am a science advocate, if the “science” of climate change followed the scientific method they would have nothing to talk about, because the math does not add up.

  30. “I love this term “Flat Earther” it’s calling someone a Heretic because they don’t believe in your religion.”

    Seems appropriate. You disregard the science because you don’t want to comprehend the implications of what it says. Hence flat earther.

    “I am a science advocate, if the “science” of climate change followed the scientific method they would have nothing to talk about, because the math does not add up.”

    They do follow the scientific method. You just don’t want to understand it so instead of admitting you don’t understand it you pretend that it is wrong.

  31. Patrick

    I am critical of Cuomo, and of your governor, of the issue of forcing nursing homes to take infected patients.

    I have visited such places, and know that they were uniquely unprepared to handle such patients.

    I didn’t make the criticism at the time ( neither did you ) because I didn’t understand it. But nursing home operators and others did complain, then.

    Mistakes are inevitable, but you can at least correct them and move on.

    Cuomo corrected his major mistakes, and NY has had an exceptionally good result for months now, by means of following the science.

    Your president has given false hope, has promoted quack cures, and has by his example and words discouraged mask wearing. And you and the other Trump supporters here ( Charles being the exception ) have joined in the jeering at masks in multiple comments and posts here, sheepishly following your leader.

  32. And when Cuomo took action against those who were intentionally violating all the rules, you took the side of the lawbreakers and super-spreaders.

    Your arguments are insincere and entirely bogus.

  33. Trump did say last night “I accept responsibility” for his covid actions, which I though was good. Trump got his punches in, so did Biden to a lesser extent, but everyone’s mind is made up at this point anyway. I’m glad for our nation that the debate was at least civil.

    I say again that I think Trump will win the election. I may even go out on a limb and agree with Patrick that he will win the popular vote. My feeling about the shy Trump vote is that strong.

  34. “My feeling about the shy Trump vote is that strong.”

    Except there is no evidence of it. There was a shy Trump vote in 2016 (with a lot of undecideds and a lot of third party support). Neither of that is the case in 2020. Similarly if there was a shy Trump vote it would likely show up in big differences between live caller polls and online polls. But that isn’t showing up either.

  35. There may be an interesting conversation here come Election Day.

    Charles, I suspect that you’ve analyzing with your heart and not your head.

    Sad to see the two not greet one another, not to exchange any pleasantries across the stage. Even boxers touch gloves at the beginning of a fight, as sign of respect and honor.

    I hope that the current scorched-earth moment passes.

    The country remains divided, in a bad place.

  36. Seamus, that’s why I said “my feeling.” Talking to Trumper friends in my network (which over here is like being in the French Underground) we are all laying very low. And remember, on the pages, I picked Trump for POTUS before he even secured the R Nomination in 2016.

  37. //Charles, I suspect that you’ve analyzing with your heart and not your head.//

    Phantom

    That may very well be true, something I have to watch after. But I’ve already voted, so for me, it’s time to sit back and speculate. I don’t have several hundred quid riding on the election like Kurt supposedly does! Just my country’s future.

  38. Early vote in person. In and out in 10 minutes.

    I know NYS will be blue, that’s a given, but in your opinion, how will the boroughs lean?

  39. I put €10 on Biden today. I rarely gamble and it was more an action against Trump than anything else.

  40. I think that all boroughs will go for Biden.

    Small pockets of NYC will go for Trump, like Breezy Point Queens or ultra Orthodox anti maskers who will vote as a bloc

    In Bay Ridge, one of the more conservative bastions, Trump will get a lot of votes but he will not get a majority. Hillary carried it four years ago.

  41. Staten Island, still.

    Heavily white, middle class, lots of fire and police force worker residents, etc.

  42. “Talking to Trumper friends in my network (which over here is like being in the French Underground) we are all laying very low.”

    And yet people can’t have it both ways (pointing to both the huge Trump rallies while also saying people are afraid to say they support Trump). And are your friends saying they are so afraid to say they support Trump that they wouldn’t even tell an anonymous online survey?

  43. In 1972, an eternity ago, Richard Nixon carried both Queens and Staten Island.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_United_States_presidential_election_in_New_York

    Reagan, GW Bush and Trump four years ago carried Staten Island but not the other boroughs

    Now that I look into it, Trump won SI by fifteen points four years ago. That’s a lot. So maybe he wins it again this time. But he is broadly less popular now, while Biden does not attract the same animosity that Hillary Clinton did.

  44. Seamus, yes, we would not answer an online survey. Who knows who’s at the other end? I was punked one time by an opposing wing of the Republican party trying to gain information. Trump rallies are different as there is safety in numbers.

  45. “Seamus, yes, we would not answer an online survey. Who knows who’s at the other end?”

    No one, that’s the point. They don’t have your address. They don’t have your phone number or any other way to trace you.

    “Trump rallies are different as there is safety in numbers.”

    They also tend to be televised. So if you are afraid of filling in an annonymous survey just in case people might find out that you are a Trump supporter but don’t mind going to a televised event as a Trump supporter then I don’t think you’ve thought the whole thing through.

  46. I say again that I think Trump will win the election. I may even go out on a limb and agree with Patrick that he will win the popular vote. My feeling about the shy Trump vote is that strong.

    Charles

    I hope you have a darkened room to lie down in on 4 November 🙂

  47. The pollsters got the popular vote about right in 2016 but they failed to detect the “shy Trumpers” in the three rustbelt states (Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania) that Trump won by an aggregate 100,000 votes and that gave him his win in the College.

    In 2020 the pollsters have taken big steps to avoid a repeat of that fail and they are showing Biden comfortably winning those three states on 3 November. But in addition Trump is having to battle in Arizona and Iowa and even Georgia and Biden appears to be ahead in Florida. If Biden wins Pennsylvania and Florida then Trump is toast.

  48. It is also worth pointing out that the polls had Clinton on 47% and she got 48%. But had Trump on 44% and he got 46%. So both candidates got some of the undecided, but Trump got a bigger proportion than Clinton (about 2 to 1). So Trump got 25% of the undecideds/third party, Clinton got 15% and the third party candidates got 60%.

    Even assuming the exact same thing happens in 2020 that happened in 2016 the it would be 52%-45% in favour of Biden. So for Trump to win the polls would need the error rate in the polls to be six times what they were in 2016.

  49. I think that Charles and Patrick may be suffering what’s called “confirmation bias” in that the news media they watch and the people they meet and greet are overwhelmingly on their side of the fence. In that GOP echo-chamber it would be easy to convince yourself that the polls are so far wrong that your guy will win easily and even win the popular vote, despite losing it by 3 million in 2016 and having very poor approval ratings in 2020.

  50. I say again that I think Trump will win the election. I may even go out on a limb and agree with Patrick that he will win the popular vote. My feeling about the shy Trump vote is that strong.

    I’m pretty sure that there are more shy Trump votes now than in 2016.

    Commies will never understand the base conservative and patriotic instinct to just say what is polite in public. Shy conservatives have long befuddled pollsters over here. They will never understand it because pollsters don’t come from those demographic backgrounds and are psychologically different. It’s a barrier they cannot hope to cross.

    Michael Moore is an anti-Trumper by any measure. But he understood the motive. And he put it brilliantly ahead of 2016 when he (along with someone in these here parts – cough) predicted that Trump would win. Moore knew it and is a very good communicator –

  51. “Commies will never understand the base conservative and patriotic instinct to just say what is polite in public.”

    And yet those answer the polls in private are giving the same answer. If it was about saying one thing in private and one thing in public then the live vs online polls would give different results.

    “They will never understand it because pollsters don’t come from those demographic backgrounds and are psychologically different. It’s a barrier they cannot hope to cross.”

    And yet they were accurate in 2016, and 2018. But won’t be in 2020?

  52. I’m pretty sure that there are more shy Trump votes now than in 2016.

    Maybe, but they sure as hell have plenty to be shy about. The pandemic has exposed all the worst aspects of Trump in a cruel remorseless light. A small but significant section of the vote he got in 2016 has deserted him. And his threats to refuse to accept defeat will backfire big time because the Dems are motivated as hell to get their voters out and to get their votes in early.

    The schmuck needed a knockout in the debate last night and he didn’t get one. So now it’s desperation stakes. Either a war against Iran or a “criminal investigation” into Biden or a police shooting and more riots.

    Tick tock.

  53. 2020 is different b/c there is violence directed against Trump voters this year who outwardly express their opinions. So we don’t express our opinion.

  54. Ok Charles, we will soon know if you are right.

    Let’s just hope your guy has the grace to accept defeat if and when it’s obvious he has lost, but of course that would be totally out of character. It will be interesting to see if the more decent instincts of the GOP manage to reassert themselves in that scenario, but I can’t say I’m optimstic, given their abject surrender since 2016.

  55. “2020 is different b/c there is violence directed against Trump voters this year who outwardly express their opinions. So we don’t express our opinion.”

    And violence directed against Democrats as well. So I guess there should be shy Democrats.

  56. The website FiveThirtyEight gives Biden an 88 percent chance of winning on Nov. 3. On Oct. 20, 2016, FiveThirtyEight gave Clinton an 87 percent chance of winning.

    https://thehill.com/homenews/media/522016-trafalgar-chief-pollster-predicts-trump-victory-polls-predominantly-missing

    Peter, yes we shall soon see. I’m predicting and E.C. victory just over the wire. Pence was in the northern district of Maine after their 1 E.V. No predictions of a landslide from me.

  57. ahh knock it off charles, you got to vote, no-one stood in your way
    there are thousands of places in the southern states where its almost impossible to vote due to suppression and taking away polling booths
    you have it easy and no-one is after you
    On the other side Trump crazies are threatening to steal kill and destroy and intimidate voters not pro-trump bothe before and after the election if things don’t go their way
    victim does not suit you – surprised you play that card !

    Josh Bernstein and Bill Deagle Are Ready to Wage Violent Civil War If Trump Loses

    Radical right–wing commentator Josh Bernstein appeared on “The NutriMedical Report” Tuesday, where he and host Bill Deagle repeatedly vowed to wage a violent civil war and kill left-wing activists if they “steal” the election from President Donald Trump.

    Given that Bernstein has repeatedly insisted that any Joe Biden win will be due only to “massive voter fraud” and therefore illegitimate, it seems as if he and Deagle are fully prepared to engage in violence unless Trump is reelected.

  58. Seamus, that smacks of whataboutary. I did read about a hay display about Biden burned, but it’s the only act of vandalism against the Dems I’ve read about, and which I condemn BTW. Good hay takes work.

  59. Kurt

    Since you have money riding on the election, let’s just say I “discount” your musings.

  60. “Seamus, that smacks of whataboutary. I did read about a hay display about Biden burned, but it’s the only act of vandalism against the Dems I’ve read about, and which I condemn BTW. Good hay takes work.”

    It isn’t whataboutary. If violence against conservatives causes shy Trump voters then surely violence against liberals would cause shy Biden voters?

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