55 1 min 8 yrs

A competition which I have just become aware of deserves, I believe, the earnest attention of ATW readers.

It is the annual competition to determine the Royal Air Force Image of the Year.…..People’s choice.

All you have to do is go to the Website, select your favourite photo and, of course; vote.

My own selection was, of course, probably the most graceful fighter aircraft of the whole of WW2:-

agreatplane

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55 thoughts on “A war, and a aircraft, to remember.

  1. As history yes, I agree with your choice.
    But the RAF is practically non existent now, hopelessly inadequate for our potential needs.
    When your link include photos of dogs being put through basic pilot training you know we’re in trouble.. ๐Ÿ˜‰

  2. In view of the recent commemorations, I propose this one, the most important RAF plane when it started (the RAF, not the Camel).

    // I thought the one David picked//

    Poor Troll.

  3. The RAF as we know it is changing. Huge amounts of money, both in Europe and the US are being invested in AI and pilotless planes. At the end of the day, this type of aircraft can handle G-forces better, and make decisions faster than a human pilot.

  4. sorry Mike I didn’t have my glasses on I thought that this was Davids post.

    my apologies.

  5. My dear old Dad left me four Brian Knight pictures, a De Haviland mosquito D B4, Hawker Hurricane MK II A, Handly Page Halifax B Mk II, and a Short sterling B Mk I.

    I have had them for years, they are stunning works of art, must have them appraised one of these days.

  6. There’s nothing like the sound of Spitfire’s Merlin engine. I last saw one a couple of summer’s ago, having a pint outside The Red Lion in Avebury. Come on, what a place to have a pint.

    Up there, circling high above the stones was a Spitfire, and – oh joy of joys – a couple of German tourists asked if the could join me on the table. Why of course, and have you seen a Spitfire before? Your grandfather might have …

    Anyway, here’s a quick low pass which scares the life out of a reporter. It always makes me laugh, that one.

  7. But the RAF is practically non existent now, hopelessly inadequate for our potential needs.

    Agit – what would our “potential needs ” be? Who is the ‘threat’?

  8. Ask the Georgians.

    Ask the Balts.

    Ask the Poles, who will never forget what some here never remembered.

    Ask the Ukranians.

    You won’t agree with their answer, and I will agree with you that that threat they’ll speak of is not imminent to you, but history has not been kind to those who have chosen weakness as a strategy.

  9. Agit โ€“ what would our โ€œpotential needs โ€ be? Who is the โ€˜threatโ€™?

    Well, the nearest obvious one would be Russia, but we also have to consider the possibility of Islamic extremists getting control of say, Pakistan’s nuclear weapons or Syria’s airforce -or Iraq’s for example.
    Okay, they probably won’t come over in waves, but they could be used as suicide bombs as per 9/11. The point is that we are vulnerable because after originally relying on the US military umbrella we or our politicians were stupid enough to buy into the idea of a European integrated force, and run our own capability down even further. If we need to protect any overseas interests or shift our soldier around we won’t have sufficient capability.
    As far as I am concerned we are heading towards a clash with Islamic extremism and how far that will pull in European Muslim communities is anyone’s guess. A conflagration with Russian over the Ukraine is less likely but still possible, as Russian is chumming up with China, and China has ambitions to dominate Asia.
    A flexible airforce able to properly defend our own airspace whilst having sufficient capacity to respond overseas would seem essential.

  10. as the the west has more and embraced a disarmament philosophy even here in the U.S. we are are approaching pre world war levels Russia, China, and the Islamic Nations are doing the opposite.

    Russia over the past ten years has modernized every weapon system it has. It is also not the old Soviet Union it’s a society that’s quasi capitalistic and ruled by a thugocracy. The system for the people is 100 times better than it was under Politburo the people also supported the move of holding Crimea by force.

    Putin’s popularity is at 80%, are any of leaders that high? He wants the pieces of land that the former soviet union held. With that kind of internal support plus the unabated modernization of his forces what is there to stop him?

    We have allowed our leaders to disarm and create a vacuum. Vacuums don’t last they always get filled by something else.

    Russia however is not the biggest threat in this area, they also are enjoying the money and prosperity they have under their new system. They will take things that they feel are vital but they are playing the long game.

    The Islamic nations are the issue. Pakistan, Turkey, Iran, Saudi Arabia these maybe culturally backward nations to us, but they are very technical. They have great wealth and great ambition along with millions of people willing to die. They want and will acquire the Aircraft and other weapons they need to do what ever they want. Look at the situation in that region who does it look like is going to get the upper hand those that believe Islam is a religion of Peace, or those that prescribe to the notion that Islam dictates that it should rule all others?

    Now look at our decreases in planes, ships, tanks, and ask if you feel this is wise?

  11. Syria has been destroyed by Syrians and by foreign jihadis. And by no one else.

    Every branch of the US military is much more effective than that of Russia.

    Europeans have spent too little on their militaries over time, an accusation that absolutely cannot be made of the US.

  12. Phantom,
    As far as I know the airplanes and rockets etc of these destroyed Islamic nations are still there and ISIS will want to use them against the West.
    Why people think the aggression will halt at the borders of Europe and the US is beyond me.
    As the Troll points out even countries like Turkey could turn against the West and throw their lot in with these Islamic warriors.
    It doesn’t have to be logical in our Western understanding of logical, it only has to be a rallying cry to all Muslims to complete the victory of Islam and the rule of the universal caliphate..
    The evidence that this is happening is all around us.

  13. The deterioration of the Turkish secular state and the Turkish turn from ally of Israel to near-enemy of it bears close watching.

  14. Agit

    See this, which questions whether Turkey was ever a secular state.

    The Myth of Turkish Secularism

    The Turkish government massively supports and funds Islam โ€“ specifically Sunni Islam โ€“ inside the country. Turkey simultaneously represses religions such as Alevism, and bullies and persecutes indigenous Christians, most of whom it liquidated in 20th century genocides. Moreover, it uses Islam to project Turkish political power into Europe, Asia, and elsewhere. Turkeyโ€™s system is more properly termed State Islam.

    State Islam

    The Directorate of Religious Affairs โ€“ known as the Diyanet โ€“ is the government body that represents and directs all of Sunni Islam in Turkey. Created in 1924, a year after the Republic of Turkey was formed, the Diyanet is enshrined in Article 136 of the Turkish Constitution. The Diyanet is huge and powerful. Operating under the Prime Minister, it employs about 100,000. All Sunni clergy are salaried civil servants of the Diyanet.

  15. //The deterioration of the Turkish secular state and the Turkish turn from ally of Israel to near-enemy of it bears close watching.//

    It’s always fun watching two religious states face off, each pretending that their god is better than the other’s.

    The decline of Christian culture in Turkey is depressing. Strange to think that even Iran today has a higher percentage of Christians than the country where Christianity really started as a world religion.

    In Turkey – like in some many places in the E. Mediterranean region – Christianity was Orthodox and too closely linked to Greece, for historical reasons.
    “Orthodox” in fact used to mean “Greek”, just as in the early church all Christians that were not originally Jewish were referred to as “Greeks”.

    When then the very unreligious wars broke out between Turkey and Greece, from the early 1800s until 1974, the Christian population in Turkey were considered fifth columnists og Greeks and suffered accordingly; many simply upped and left.
    (Turks living in Greek ares more or less shared the same fate)

  16. Hitler was a close observer and an admirer of how the Turks ( including Turkish Kurds ) treated the Armenians.

    And the Turkish massacres of a remnant Greek population continued until the 1950s for Gods sake.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Istanbul_pogrom

    But you hear very little of any of this, except once in a while when the Armenians do some political agitation. Its as though it never happened.

  17. //But you hear very little of any of this,//

    True, but you hear even less of the Greek pogroms against Turkish minorites.
    They also happened; I’ve seen the evidence – rows of ruined houses, deserted villages.

    Mixing nationhood with religion always leads to disaster.

  18. The Turks sure got the better of that one.

    The invading Turks stole a country, and a great city.

    Istanbul ( Constantinople ) was a Greek city. Even now, most of the interesting sites there are Greek, not Turkish.

  19. The Turks get all righteous about Israel’s treatment of its Arabs but they sure don’t ever want to talk about it’s treatment of Armenians and Greeks. They’re not sorry about it at all.

  20. Don’t mention the Turks … please

    BBC News – Cameron ‘anger’ at slow pace of Turkish EU …

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-10767768

    27 Jul 2010 – David Cameron argues for Turkey’s membership of the European Union, saying … David Cameron has promised to “fight” for Turkey’s membership of the European … After his visit to Turkey

    Just want the UK needs right now, is 70,000,000 Turks having full access to the UK’s borders.

    But Dave apparently is doing all he can to ‘stem the tide’ of immigrants into the UK ๐Ÿ˜‰

  21. Maybe London can become a Turkish city some day, just like Constantinople was co opted and transformed.

    Would not that be marvelous

  22. Maybe London can become a Turkish city some day, just like Constantinople was co opted and transformed.

    Would not that be marvelous

    As long as it is restricted to London .. it’s a multi-cultured crap hole anyway ๐Ÿ˜‰

  23. London has much that is good, much that is bad, but it is a great world city, and I like it.

    Have you spent any time there recently?

  24. //The invading Turks stole a country, and a great city.
    Istanbul ( Constantinople ) was a Greek city.//

    I didn’t realise one can go back so far.

    The Israelis stole Jaffa and Acre, Palestinian citities.

    But because you allow yourself such historical scope, then the invading Israelites also stole Jerusalem and Jericho from the Canaanites. ๐Ÿ™‚

  25. Have you spent any time there recently?

    I had to take a few trips, one on business, and a couple to Admiralty House, that was enough thanks.

    I still have family in Kentish Town, and Wembley, I only usually have to make that trip when someone dies ๐Ÿ˜‰

  26. Again, the Turkish massacres of Christians went on well into the 20th Century.

    And yet they point the bony finger of self righteousness at Israel.

    The Israelis are living in the land of their ancestors.

    The Turk stole a Greek city and lands.

    If we are to criticize settlers, lets have the Turks evacuate Istanbul ( Constantinople ) and Izmir ( Smyrna )and move back to central Asia where they belong.

  27. If we are to criticize settlers, lets have the Turks evacuate Istanbul ( Constantinople ) and Izmir ( Smyrna )and move back to central Asia where they belong.

    Yeah! And, while we’re at it, let’s get all those b*stards out of America and give it back to it’s original owners!

    Also – get those lousy Angles, Saxons and Jutes out of Sasann! ๐Ÿ™‚

  28. It was lovely thanks, Agi. Great weather, very relaxing. The kids loved the entertainment, and we enjoyed the lovely artisan villages and the wine ๐Ÿ™‚

  29. Good,
    I’ve forgotten where you went..
    Sounds lovely though and I am glad you all had a good time.

  30. The Turks can get out of Northern Cyprus too before they point the finger at anyone else.

  31. Sorry about that.

    Pete

    We were in a camp between the towns of Les Mathes and La Palmyre, in southwest France. It’s about 7 miles from Royan, and about 45 miles from La Rochelle.

    Royan is interesting. The area is known locally as ‘La Poche’, or ‘The Pocket’. It was one of the last pockets of German resistance in France after D-Day. The Allies decided to make an example of the remaining German garrison, by blowing it to pieces. They bombed the town out of existence in a series of attacks in 1945, employing 350 RAF heavy bombers, B-17 Flying Fortresses and B-24 Liberators. The Americans used napalm for the first time ever on Royan. All in all, they destroyed the town, killed over 2700 civilians, and only 23 German soldiers (apparently there was a translation problem, and the Allied bombers didn’t know the garrison was stationed outside the town!). Royan was re-built in the 50s, and is a lovely place now, though strikingly modern in comparison to its neighboring towns and villages.

    The entire region is steeped in history. From where we were camped, we were within an hour’s drive of numerous French Chateaux, WWII museums, Templar churches, a Roman amphitheater, and of course, the beautiful town of Cognac, with its famous distilleries.

  32. Colm, on August 6th, 2014 at 9:15 PM Said:
    French people ?

    I rather suspect Troll is asking whether or not I ran into any ravening mobs of Muslims, as the only time France seems to be mentioned here, it’s in connection with Burqas or Muslim men going mental.

    If so, then the answer is no, Troll. We did certainly see, and indeed spoke to some Muslim people but, I’m sorry to say they were every bit as friendly and polite as the ‘ordinary’ French people we met ๐Ÿ™‚

  33. We met French people, some who supported Israel, some who opposed Israel’s actions. We didn’t see any protests firsthand, but I did spot a Palestinian flag or two in some of the bigger towns.

    no donโ€™t be sorry to say, thatโ€™s a good thing

    I know, I was just kidding ๐Ÿ™‚

  34. I can’t assume anyone is kidding anymore.

    When I think they are kidding they are serious, and when I think they are serious they are kidding.

    I assume nothing anymore, I’ve hurt to many peoples feelings and would like to avoid that.

  35. Seimi,
    A lovely area, we went through there on our way up from the Dordogne to La Rochelle. Going on from there we headed slightly north east towards Niort and found this incredible area..
    http://www.france-voyage.com/tourism/green-venice-poitevin-marsh-1929.htm

    If you decide to go back to France rather than Norfolk (probably a wiser choice!) do try and see it. Plenty of campsites and cheaper than many areas. It used to have its own waterway culture..
    I take it you drove down? Did you use toll or main roads?
    Just talking about it makes me want to go again.

  36. Troll

    Perhaps you’re being a tad over-sensitive?

    Agi

    No, we flew from Dublin to La Rochelle, though I have driven once. I wouldn’t do it again. A full day’s drive from Belfast to Rosslare, then an overnight ferry (which stank and was awful), and then almost another full day’s driving to get to the camp. And all with the knowledge that you have to do it all again at the end of the holiday.

    We took the toll roads mainly, which was a pity, as you get to see very little of the countryside. I’d like to spend a bit longer in the area, and travel around a bit more. Poitevin looks lovely.

  37. Sewimi,
    I love driving and never use toll roads unless by accident!
    But there again, I haven’t got a dozen kids and a grumpy wife to contend with… ๐Ÿ˜‰

  38. Sewimi,
    I love driving and never use toll roads unless by accident!
    But there again, I havenโ€™t got a dozen kids and a grumpy wife to contend withโ€ฆ

    I always use them ๐Ÿ˜‰

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