156 1 min 4 yrs

North Korea is willing to talk about getting rid of its nuclear weapons but only if its own safety can be guaranteed, South Korea says.

The South says the subject was raised when its officials met with the North’s leader, Kim Jong-un, in Pyongyang on Monday, during a rare visit.

They said Mr Kim is also open to US talks, and would pause weapons testing.

How very interesting. It’s as if the neocon approach – banging the table, demanding submission, promising war – might be a touch counterproductive. Regimes marked for destruction tend to make plans to defend themselves. Libya, Iraq, Syria, Iran, North Korea et al spent vast sums on military hardware, in great part as a reaction to Western belligerence to begin with. We’d get along much better if only we’d keep our noses out of such places.

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156 thoughts on “A WHIFF OF SANITY IN NORTH KOREA?

  1. in great part as a reaction to Western belligerence to begin with.

    And you were making such good sense until you just had to say that.

  2. North Korea can ditch all it’s weapons.

    It won’t make a blind bit of difference, not until it allows the correct central banking cartel to replace the one they have already got.

    In the year of 2000 there were seven countries without a Rothschild owned Central Bank:

    Afghanistan
    Iraq
    Sudan
    Libya
    Cuba
    North Korea
    Iran

    Now there are only 3

    Cuba
    North Korea
    Iran

    Basically, it’s irrelevant what these last three countries ‘give up’.

    They are royally screwed.

  3. It is all an internet kookalamunga obsession.

    Spare some tears for the starving North Korean population, and quit worrying about banks and the leadership there.

  4. Phantom, on March 6th, 2018 at 7:14 PM Said:
    It is all an internet kookalamunga obsession.

    Whatever, sooner or later, Cuba, NK, and Iran will see those cruise missiles flying above their heads.

    War = money

  5. in great part as a reaction to Western belligerence to begin with.

    That’s pretty much true. NK is a valuable ‘enemy’ for the west to stir now and again because it allows China’s tail to be tweaked. And if NK were to collapse, American troops could be on the Yalu River – and what could be wrong with that? After all, US troops are 60 miles from St Petersburg

  6. Phantom, on March 6th, 2018 at 7:45 PM Said:
    Yes, the regime is the real victim

    Of US imperialism

    And the banks

    They will find that out soon enough, the same as Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya have already done.

  7. They will be a lot poorer, and a who!e lot more dead soon enough, when American military Inc starts to send the cruise missiles in.

  8. Harri and Allan are just easily brainwashed by our modern alt-Internet conspiracy swirls.

  9. A whiff of murder in England as another Putin enemy is poisoned. The Putinistas hereabouts will reflect their master’s voice, as always, but some of us can think for ourselves:

    “The UK would respond “robustly” to any evidence of Russian involvement in the collapse of former spy Sergei Skripal, Boris Johnson has said. Mr Skripal, 66, and his daughter Yulia, 33, are critically ill in hospital after being found unconscious in Salisbury, Wiltshire. The foreign secretary said he was not pointing fingers at this stage, but described Russia as “a malign and disruptive force”.

    Russia has denied any involvement.”

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43303651

  10. Here is the ATW line, just a wild guess:

    “Andrei Lugovoi, one of the prime suspects in the murder of Alexander Litvinenko, has suggested that the apparent poisoning of a Russian spy in Salisbury is part of a British campaign to demonise Moscow.

    “I don’t rule out that this is another provocation by British intelligence agencies,” said Lugovoi, a pro-Kremlin MP and former FSB spy agency officer.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/06/kremlin-denies-russian-involvement-in-mystery-illness-former-spy-sergei-skripal?CMP=twt_gu

  11. What kinda peace love and bobby sherman nonsense are you spewing Moore….? You want to put a flower behind Yung Fat Dumb’s ear…. ahhh how sweet.

    I love this common diseased train of thought it runs rampant among a certain type of fool. Now you can take that personally but I assure you it’s an observation, and you’re not alone. The fact that you’re not alone makes it no less pure idiocy however…

    You and others that suffer from both a lack of understanding of human nature and the moral guidance of a soul always spout the same nonsense. “Oh if we didn’t bother them they won’t bother us, and if we’re nice to them they’ll be nice to us”…. bullshit.

    What in all of recorded has lead you to this belief?

    What period of Time, what events, on what do you base this belief on?

    The History of mankind is one of war and strife, constant conflict. There has not been a single week in history where man hasn’t been a threat to his fellow man. From the individual to the nation we are a hostile species.

    The only thing that keeps us from tearing each other apart is our soul, our morality. You dismiss god a soul and morality. They are concepts you refuse to grasp. With out that belief and understanding of a soul you can never understand that evil does exist and is a major influence in quite a few nations.

    The only way to control evil is fear and violence. If you refuse to use fear and violence then fear and violence will be used on you.

    The mad little fat man wants to talk so he won’t get bombed while he finishes his nuclear ballistic program, this is not a new tactic with the Norks this is sop. And if he can get direct talks that’s a real coup they’ve been trying for that for decades.

    The only way this prick doesn’t finish his bomb is if we blow the hell out of it. If we don’t destroy it he’ll have functioning long rang nuclear missiles in a year to 18mths and they will become North Korea’s number one export.

  12. The only way to control evil is fear and violence. If you refuse to use fear and violence

    Some people, you know the people with faith, prefer to put their trust in God.

  13. Pete Moore siding with an ultra Communist dictator against the free capitalist west?

    Some mistake surely?

    England should pull out of the World Cup in Russia. It was won by corruption and Putin is murdering his opponents with impunity.

    Absolutely correct Peter however there is another reason to boycott it:

    Senior government officials fear the violence unleashed by Russian hooligans at Euro 2016 was sanctioned by the Kremlin and are investigating links with Vladimir Putin’s regime.

    It is understood that a significant number of those involved in savage and highly coordinated attacks on England fans and others in Marseille and Lille have been identified as being in the “uniformed services” in Russia.

    The theory is that the sanctioning of hooliganism by Putin is a continuation of what has been described as Russia’s campaign of “hybrid warfare”. Whitehall experts fear the tactic is a ploy to demonstrate Russian strength while building on a narrative inside the country that the rest of the world is lining up against it.

    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2016/jun/18/whitehall-suspects-kremlin-links-to-russian-euro-2016-hooligans-vladimir-putin

    Spartak Moscow came to Bilbao last week and amid the chaos an Ertzaintza died:

    http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/43164001

    Russia 2018 is going to be a bloodbath outside the stadia.

  14. //The only thing that keeps us from tearing each other apart is our soul,…
    With out that belief and understanding of a soul you can never understand that evil does exist and is a major influence in quite a few nations. //

    “Evil” seems to thrive best where people have that belief in a soul; in places like Arabia and the loonier parts of the US.

    Societies with more atheists seem to be more peaceful.

    Just look at all the people with souls tearing each other apart in Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan. Good old souls, what?

  15. The only thing that keeps us from tearing each other apart is our soul […]

    Societies with more atheists seem to be more peaceful

    I don’t know about souls or atheists but I’d suggest that the biggest barrier to ripping people to shreds is our intrinsic empathetical humanity rather than religious doctrine or spiritual creed.

  16. Anyone who suggests North Korea is the victim of Western belligerence is a liar or a fool. Probably both.

  17. Whitehall experts fear the tactic is a ploy to demonstrate Russian strength while building on a narrative inside the country that the rest of the world is lining up against it.

    It’s good that Paul is supporeting his fellow Britons, especially England’s fooball supporters who dindu-nuffin, especially in Dublin. The main damage that the Russians did is to have counter-hacked the drug-test labs and revealed who had been given what and when in the sports of the countries that are attempting to exclude Russia from sporting events based on drug-taking.

  18. The Soviet Union under Stalin, China under Mao, Cambodia under Pol Pot were entirely run by atheists

  19. our intrinsic empathetical humanity as Paul put it is our souls.

    I don’t care if you worship Christ, Allah, Buddha, a Tree or nothing at all.

    We each have a part of ourselves that rules us. Call it what you want, I call it a soul. That part of us is influenced by either good or evil.

    Look at the nations that Phantom listed. All nonbelievers yet each and everyone of them evil.

    To deny the existence of Evil is to live in a fantasy.

  20. Phantom, on March 7th, 2018 at 12:01 PM Said:

    The Soviet Union under Stalin, China under Mao, Cambodia under Pol Pot were entirely run by atheists

    Darn – I was about to write that 🙁

    Anyway, the atheists win the murder-count

  21. It’s good that Paul is supporting his fellow Britons

    So, I’m a plastic Paddy in Pamplona and also a fellow Brit.

    I wish you’d make up your mind. It seems like the fickleness of extremism is mixing its identity metaphors.

    Our intrinsic empathetical humanity as Paul put it is our souls.

    Perhaps you are correct Pat but the existence of some spiritual entity within our physical form has never been proven and there are (tens of?) millions who don’t believe in such a thing.

    Evil absolutely does exist and resides in every human being.

  22. This isn’t the first time that Pete has demonstrated a benign understanding of the North Korean regime.

    They’ve long deprived their population of every human right in the book, their policies have directly led to mass famine in very recent times, yet the only criticism is directed at the ” neocons ” who are ” promising war “.

    I’d like to see any solution here, even if imperfect. For the sake of the region, and world, but mostly for the sake of the long suffering people in the northern part of the Korean nation.

  23. They are ruled and subjugated by an evil family.

    Paul all living creatures have a soul.

    It is beyond our ability at this point to prove it, but the soul exists nonetheless.

  24. I’d like to see any solution here, even if imperfect. For the sake of the region, and world, but mostly for the sake of the long suffering people in the northern part of the Korean nation.

    Sanctioning the long suffering people, and placing them further into deprivation is probably not the best idea in the world.

  25. Now if you want to go down the rabit hole…. when does a thing acquire a soul?

    When will our AI creations become more than machines….

    That is a topic that has forever held my fascination…

  26. Sanctioning the long suffering people, and placing them further into deprivation is probably not the best idea in the world.

    yes it is, especially with the NORKS.

  27. If you take sanctions off the table, you have no leverage of any kind against criminal and dangerous regimes. You make war the only option.

    All responsibility for the extreme poverty in NK rests with the regime. Not with Japan, not with South Korea, not with the US, not with any ” neocons ” to use the stupid word that has passed its sell by date.

  28. Paul all living creatures have a soul

    I personally find it difficult to believe that premise Pat but if that’s your belief you’re entitled to it.

    I agree that it’s a fascinating subject which has fascianted philosophers, physicians and theoligans for eons.

    As to the north Koreans, spending buckets of loot on weapons while sections of your populace are starving wouldn’t be the greatest of policy decisions IMO.

  29. Yes.

    The North Korean government is responsible for their own actions.

    Not any ” neocons “

  30. I should think after decades of sanctions, the North Koreans, well the peasants anyway, are well used to it.

    So far, sanctions don’t appear to have made a blind bit of difference, the NK regime are very adept at underhandedly getting around any new or past sanctions.

    The Chinese and the Russians will always assist the NK regime there.

  31. I support Trump when he is squeezing the Chinese here.

    There haven’t been airtight sanctions before.

    Lets try that.

  32. sanctions are actually serving a multiple set of purposes.

    A nice thing under the current administration that hasn’t occurred before is we are publicly calling out the Chicoms and the Russians as they violate them.

    It has given us another card in dealing with them.

  33. All sanctions on NK appears to simply make them even more resilient.

    I’m pretty sure it has never been beyond the realms of possibility to target the NK hierarchy, and take them out by some measure?.

    A fish always rots from the head down.

  34. Yes.

    That is smart.

    Shine a bright light on those who are cooperate in busting sanctions. If they don’t want the publicity, stop trading with NK.

    The current state of affairs can’t be tolerated any more.

  35. The Chinese have been two faced, sneaky, weak.

    If they want to be a leader in Asia, they need to step it up here.

  36. I personally find it difficult to believe that premise Pat but if that’s your belief you’re entitled to it.

    You believe in nothing outside of the physical existence ?

    just a question not an argument. I believe each individual has the right to their own beliefs. It is the foundation of freedom. Without that one core belief freedom does not exist.

    I just question you on what you hold to be true. I find these things are the real core of a person.

  37. The Chinese need to make some hard decisions.

    If they are going to go to the next stage they have to grow in their cultural ethics, both internally and externally.

  38. I think that the Chinese are afraid of North Korea, as well they might be.

    While they’re indecisive and sneaky in north Asia, their military continues to hold islands that are not theirs in the international waters of the South China Sea. None of the other south Asian powers has the ability to challenge them very much on this.

    China is imperialist, a problem. Their relative power is likely to increase, no matter what we do.

  39. You believe in nothing outside of the physical existence ?

    I’m not sure what you mean Pat. Radio waves for example exist outside of physical existence but if you’re referring to something specific to me then I suppose the answer would be no.

  40. wasn’t talking radio or things you can’t more things that we can’t yet measure. and in the realm of living creatures such as us.

  41. If your talking about things in a spiritual context as opposed to the energy in our bodies and around us then I suppose the answer is no as I’ve never had fundamental proof of such things. I wouldn’t be as arrogant as to give a definitive no on that however and, much like the debate over the existence of God, I would absolutely be open to persuasion on the matter.

  42. North Korea depends on China economically.

    China uses North Korea as a lever against the US.

    Trump says 25% tariffs on steel and suddenly China gets North Korea to (maybe) negotiate, talk demilitarization.

  43. “The response to President Trump’s tariff announcement is chaotic,” said an analyst at the New York Stock Exchange today. “No-one understands the focus.” China, which many people expected to be the focus of President Trump’s antagonistic trade policies, called his decision “remarkably stupid” and highlighted the risk to global trade, although it said that the impact on its own steel industry would be small. And the European Union threatened to respond with punitive tariffs on three iconic exports to the U.S.: Harley Davison motorcycles, bourbon whiskey and blue jeans.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/francescoppola/2018/03/05/president-trumps-steel-and-aluminium-tariffs-are-not-about-china/#59c50b382ba6

  44. Indeed, Phantom.

    Methinks China is a smokescreen for what is just common garden protectionism

  45. But it’s a particularly incompetent protectionism.

    He’s hurting our friends here, and not hurting China, and is driving up the cost of US made products.

    He’s winging it.

    And he’s losing any credibility with the markets that he may ever have had. They loved the tax cuts for the corporations but they see nothing positive in a tariff war, not for the US economy, not for the stock market.

  46. Noel

    “Evil” seems to thrive best where people have that belief in a soul; in places like Arabia and the loonier parts of the US.

    Societies with more atheists seem to be more peaceful.

    Well said Noel. And they don’t just ‘seem to be more peaceful.’ it’s a fact that atheist countries are generally more peaceful with less crime.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/jan/06/peace-on-earth-atheism

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-secular-life/201410/secular-societies-fare-better-religious-societies

  47. Allan@Aberdeen,

    The Soviet Union under Stalin, China under Mao, Cambodia under Pol Pot were entirely run by atheists

    Darn – I was about to write that 🙁

    Anyway, the atheists win the murder-count

    Wrong again.
    Far more have been murdered in the name of religion.
    And those atrocities where NOT committed in the name of atheism.

  48. The anti human atheistic communist regimes would get top marks in the 20th Century.

  49. Interesting read here…

    Doesn’t religion cause most of the conflict in the world?

    Atheists like Mao or Pol Pot have murdered millions in the name of political totalitarianism. Hitler used a quasi-mystical racist philosophy to exploit the ancient hatred of the Jews by Christians. I heard somewhere (I’ve never been able to discover where) that terrorism occurs when you combine a sense of military and economic inferiority with a sense of moral superiority. Religion is very good at conferring a sense of moral superiority on its followers.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jul/02/religion-wars-conflict

  50. Patrick Van Roy,

    Now if you want to go down the rabit hole…. when does a thing acquire a soul?

    When will our AI creations become more than machines….

    That is a topic that has forever held my fascination…

    Are you saying that when something becomes self aware it acquires a soul Pat?

  51. Phantom,

    The anti human atheistic communist regimes would get top marks in the 20th Century.

    Meaning what exactly? None of these regimes murdered in the name of atheism or for reasons linked to a lack of religious belief.

  52. Dave,
    I believe that the numbers show that atheism wins the murder count:

    An 800-page compendium of the crimes of Communist regimes worldwide, recorded and analyzed in ghastly detail by a team of scholars. The facts and figures, some of them well known, others newly confirmed in hitherto inaccessible archives, are irrefutable. The myth of the well-intentioned founders–the good czar Lenin betrayed by his evil heirs–has been laid to rest for good. No one will any longer be able to claim ignorance or uncertainty about the criminal nature of Communism, and those who had begun to forget will be forced to remember anew.–Tony Judt “New York Times “

    As the death toll mounts — as many as 25 million in the former Soviet Union, 65 million in China, 1.7 million in Cambodia, and on and on — the authors systematically show how and why, wherever the millenarian ideology of Communism was established, it quickly led to crime, terror, and repression. An extraordinary accounting, this book amply documents the unparalleled position and significance of Communism in the hierarchy of violence that is the history of the twentieth century.

    Religion may well have been brutal, but the means to mass murder didn’t exist back in those days. Communism + technology = mass murder

  53. Dave – in the name of which religion were 65 million Chinese murdered? Same question for anywhere and everywhere. Note that atheism isn’t a religion but is an absence of religion and a denial of God

  54. Allan@Aberdeen,

    Dave,
    I believe that the numbers show that atheism wins the murder count:

    As I’ve said twice already in this thread, None of these regimes murdered in the name of atheism or for reasons linked to a lack of religious belief.
    Show me how being atheist was responsible for these atrocities.

    And no. Even if you conservatively count those murdered in the name of religion in the past 2000 years, (religious Crusades and wars, inquisitions etc.) Millions more have died than in your so-called atheist atrocities.

  55. Dave – atheism is not a religion but absence of religion. The mass murders committed by communists weren’t done in the name of a religion. As for the tally of murders by muslims and Christians, there just wasn’t the population available to get the numbers wiped out by communism – circa 100 million. If you have numbers, please provide the tally.

  56. The mass murders committed by communists were carried out in the name of political totalitarianism.

  57. Allan

    Dave – atheism is not a religion but absence of religion.

    Yes, I know that Allan, where did I say it wasn’t? And what is that got to do with what we’re discussing?

    The mass murders committed by communists weren’t done in the name of a religion.

    No Allan, and for the umpteenth time, they weren’t done in the name of atheism either.

    There’s no real point continuing this debate Allan, because all we’re going to end up doing is arguing the toss over whether certain atrocities were because of religion or atheism. And at the end of the day it doesn’t matter. You might as well debate what colour clothes are worn by the largest number of killers, and try to draw a causal relationship there as well. Religion or atheism does not cause you to kill people, and it certainly doesn’t prevent you from killing people. Let’s stop pretending that it does either.

  58. NAFTA is China’s backdoor for dumping cheap steel in USA.

    NAFTA is in final rounds of negotiation. Canada is in process of making separate multi-lateral trade deal with Asian countries. China has 2 prong approach with Canada – one with NAFTA and one without NAFTA.

    I doubt if NAFTA will survive.

  59. TRUMPISM – America First – from The Conservative Treehouse:

    √ Unleash energy development. Drive down energy costs. Lower cost-of-living.
    √ Eliminate regulatory stranglehold. Unleash free market entrepreneurial expansion.
    √ Lower corporate tax burden. Position business investment ‘best bet’ domestically.
    √ Generate investment expansion. Create: jobs, jobs, jobs.
    √ Generate higher labor demand. Jobs, Jobs, Jobs = Higher wages, wages, wages.
    √ Lower middle-class tax burden. Combine higher wages with lower taxes. 2x benefits.
    ==> WE ARE HERE <==
    • Structure trade deals to benefit workers/companies inside the U.S.
    • Leverage access to U.S. market as incitement for domestic investment.
    • Economic Growth + Domestic Manufacturing Expansion = GDP increases.
    • Increased overall tax revenues from expanding economy stabilizes debt and entitlements.

  60. Says the anti-capitalist tapping away on the keys of his iPad put together by some poor Chinese low paid slave of those capitalists.

    😏

  61. Patty

    Have you found corroboration of your Puerto Rico truckers’s strike story yet

    That came from the Fake News Treehouse

  62. “Have you found corroboration of your Puerto Rico truckers’s strike story yet
    That came from the Fake News Treehouse”

    Would photos of rows upon rows of trucks not moving in the port, filled to the brim with rotting supplies count? because those photos were on the news complete with interviewer in front of them. If you want to think that PR is just hunky dory be my guest but I can say without doubt that you don’t know what you’re talking about.

    And you can name call The Conservative Treehouse research but I think you just can’t handle the truth.

    oh well. The Russians are coming!!! and then this, Trump can’t win!!! lol.

  63. You have not verified that there was any trucker strike because there was no Teamsters or other trucker union strike then

    You fell victim to intentionally placed fake news. “ news “ placed by right wing liars and or buy pranksters

    I think that you should just admit it. Never happened

  64. So Patti is now a full-on trade war protectionist. That figures.

    I guess if Trump orders the slaugher of all first-born males she will get on board with that too.

  65. FFS – trucks filled and not moving cause drivers won’t drive = trucker’s strike.

    I think you are projecting a bit here about gullibility

  66. The only Trump Cult member here who supported tariffs BT ( before Trump ) was Allan

    The rest of them are all blind followers of the False Prophet

  67. Peter: renegotiating trade agreements that are old and no longer useful is “trade war protectionist?”

    overblown rhetoric, anyone?

  68. There was no trucker strike, declared or undeclared, no work stoppage, nada

    You got tricked by the fake news machine

  69. The point is not about union strikes, Phantom. Supplies were not delivered on a timely basis. “worker stoppage” is just a bogus term – do you not remember that the island suffered a catastrophic hurricane? worker stoppage?? there was no worker stoppage because there were no workers to stoppage…..what there was were a lot of supplies lying around – undelivered – thanks to political considerations, corruption and the way the island works.

  70. Patty, on October 1st, 2017 at 7:09 PM Said:
    The Puerto Rico corrupt government wants financial aid – not actual packets of food and water.
    There are thousands of trucks filled with actual aid (food/water etc) lined up at the port, in the heat.
    Trucks don’t move because truck drivers are “on strike” means truck drivers are waiting for a financial payout. etc.

    You said this five months ago; there is zero evidence that any of this is true – its a slander against Puerto Rican working people, saying that they refused to work until they got some extra money

    The police officer that was the subject of your video was clearly a fraud also , she hasn’t been heard from since, none of this was backed up

    Puerto Rico Whistle Blower Cop

  71. Mahons, on October 9th, 2017 at 4:20 PM Said:
    Note the lack of retraction or clarification. Some people don’t think for themselves and think discussion is merely a chance to attack the other side every time.

  72. Phantom: now you’re talking about a police man/woman? – you really have lost the plot.

    do you know anyone who lives in PR? have you ever been to PR?

  73. Patty

    Your Fake news post about this fake incident includes fake audio from a fake police woman

    I don’t mind If you forget what others say, but please remember what you yourself say in your own posts

  74. Phantom I put my money on Patty.

    You have proven over and over even though you are a bright successful man you are very single minded and narrow minded in things that you have not bothered to get information on other than your leftist bias sources. Your bubble.

    and not just on this issue with Patty. I don’t fight for Patty, she does well enough on her own even with the relentless abuse from you and Mahons.

    I heard the same stories Patty has, I have not seen any evidence that they weren’t true and I have looked.

    I know that since then the elite in PR have been caught hording emergency goods.

    If I demanded you retract everything you have gotten wrong you’d be writing posts for a week on the gun issue alone and another week on your personal unfounded hate of Trump.

    Now I know you could careless what I have to say and even though you will tolerate some conversation with me I will never forget that you and you alone are the only person here to ever write an attack post against another poster namely me.

    Why don’t you let it go….

  75. Petr Tarasov, on March 7th, 2018 at 9:11 PM Said:

    I don’t have an IPad. Can you get anything right?

    I bet my last bottom dollar, the one you are using doesn’t have this ‘☭’ on it as a logo.

    😉

  76. As the USSR collapsed before the advent of the world wide web and some ten years before the first iPad was produced it’s highly unlikely.

  77. Well I did but as you’re talking about the Chinese Communist Party, unless the CPC make iPads it’s highly unlikely it would have that symbol either.

  78. Patrick

    You haven’t seen any evidence that the stories were true either. Because there is zero evidence that they were true. There are no accounts in any credible Puerto Rico or other media.

    Even FOXNews ( Shep Smith ) denounced the story as being entirely fraudulent

    Those who criticize the media at the loudest here are the most naïve and gullible who will believe anything from any source that confirms their long list of prejudices

  79. You haven’t seen any evidence that the stories were true either. Because there is zero evidence that they were true.

    Agreed Phantom, Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat

  80. Those who criticize the media at the loudest here are the most naïve and gullible who will believe anything from any source that confirms their long list of prejudices

    that’s the pot calling the kettle black…. and misses my point.

    My point is let it go…. no one here is held to the standard of putting out irrefutable facts.

    You are holding her to a standard YOU are unable to achieve yourself….

    THAT was my point.

  81. No one here is held to the standard of putting out irrefutable facts

    If that is the case Pat, and I don’t think it is, discussion on any topic here then becomes meaningless.

  82. Phantom: “You have not verified that there was any trucker strike because there was no Teamsters or other trucker union strike”

    First, you’re busting on me for Teamster unions apparently not striking in PR ???? what?? this is really out of left-field. I don’t ever remember talking about Teamster unions in PR. PR is exceptionally small and disorganized. Do you know this?

    What is the square footage of PR – Phantom? Have you ever been there?

    and now, you’re busting on what you call “a fake woman” in “a fake video.” Tinfoil hat for you is in order.

  83. You spoke of a strike, a refusal to work by Puerto Rican truckers.

    Something which if true would be a morally criminal act in the aftermath of such a gravely damaging hurricane.

    There is zero evidence that any of this happened. This was a lie put out by ” Conservative Treehouse ” and other bullshit sites, and gullible you and gullible Pat fell for it, and five months later, both of you are still defensive about your gullibility.

    We know that there were and are severe problems over there. Some of the trucks didn’t go out on a timely basis because there was no way to properly organize the truckers with all the phones and internet down, and also due to the fact that that some of the truckers themselves had just lost their own homes.

    This was told to you five months ago, neither you nor your little protector responded to those comments there, as you preferred to libel people who had just suffered from a catastrophe.

    Have you ever been there?

    That’s the question someone who is cornered,and defensive.

    You are a willing victim of the right wing Fake News machine, having engaged in wanton disregard for the truth multiple times on these pages.

  84. If that is the case Pat, and I don’t think it is, discussion on any topic here then becomes meaningless.

    Really Paul?

    Do you hold Allen to this standard, do we hold Phantom, or you to it….?

    No we do not.

    I can and have pointed out a thousand things that Phantom has been wrong about. No one demands he retract them.

    I believe your whole position on the IRA is disgracefully wrong I don’t demand you retract it.

    Everything Allan say’s and therefore Harri also is wrong where are the demands for retraction…..?

    He is being abusive. Nothing less and he has been towards her for years…..

    Enough.

  85. I disagree but I don’t have the interest nor the time to counter you. The Conservative Treehouse is not a fake site and I have some good on-the-ground contact in PR.

    Trucks didn’t deliver the goods and it wasn’t because they didn’t know how to do it. If you want to think The Conservative Treehouse is fake news that is your right. You think all sorts of things that are wrong-headed but go to it if you must.

    Snopes is not a fact-checking site – it’s 2 people and is partially funded by Facebook.

  86. You have pointed out a thousand things that you think are wrong

    Patty’s post, not retracted after five long months, is objectively wrong. And you fell for it too.

    Patty is as gullible as Allan is on this stuff. If anything appears on the internet that condemns people or groups that she does not like, they immediately, unquestioningly, agree with it, and cut and paste it. They have no bullshit detector at all.

  87. Patrick – Phantom is now spending his time “reporting” Stormy Daniels stories. That just says it all.

    He’s like a human CNN satellite – one man on the street corner – spreading propaganda to the far-off reaches of the universe.

  88. Before I go, Phantom, RUSSIA!!!

    and, then this, collusion!!!

    and this, the Dossier is supported by 15 different agencies and they CAN’T be wrong!!

    🙂 Think about it.

  89. Phantom, why don’t you give the P.R. trucker’s thing a rest? Patty is not going to retract. Otherwise you too will just have to get a room!

  90. Phantom, on March 8th, 2018 at 4:11 PM Said:
    You have pointed out a thousand things that you think are wrong

    no that says it all Phantom believes he is 100% right on everything. If you disagree well you are the one that is wrong he is the god of all truth all knowledge….

    roflmao….

    I would say more, but David would get upset at my lack of civility.

  91. Do you hold Allen to this standard, do we hold Phantom, or you to it….?

    Well, yes.

    If you have a look at any thread where Allan and I have crossed swords you’ll see proof of it, anytime Phantom and I have disagreed we’ve challenged each other with supporting links and anytime I make a point I try to reinforce it with credible third party corroboration.

    If that’s not the case then discussion on any topic here becomes meaningless

    Patty, your comments above smack of avoidance.

  92. Bull Paul….

    Occasionally one of stomps on Allan, but only occasionally and no one but me and Patty calls Phantom on his bull….

    SAo you now owe us a retraction.

  93. Patrick – Patty is often obnoxious and has at times offered laughable fabrications here. Your support for her is clearly based upon the fact that you are mostly aligned politically. No one is fooled otherwise.

  94. My support for her is simply because I believe she is being bullied….

    I very rarely interfere in these rows…. I think this one is out of line, that’s all.

  95. My support for her is simply because I believe she is being bullied….

    I’m getting a whiff of that myself. Play the ball, not the (wo)man.

  96. What is it with the left and Misogyny?..

    I did say the left are inspired by Islam.

  97. Listen you lot

    She quoted The Conservative Treehouse on this thread

    That joke of a blog was the source of her Puerto Rico fake news quote. I’d not have mentioned the PR thing again except that she referred the House of Lies again.

    I am playing the ball when I have asked her to give some evidence, anything at all, over five months. She responds with truculence and sideshow.

    So shame on you for allowing a fake narrative to take root of her being some kind of damsel in distress.

    Maybe you will want to leap to Allan’s defense next when I and others aggressively challenge his controlled demolition and racist yarns.

    Yes, play the ball. Always. But there is no ball in the case of Puerto Rican truckers refusing to work in the aftermath of a huge catastrophe. It simply didn’t happen.

  98. I happen to love men – it’s raining men, hallelujah – seriously, men are awesome. Salt and pepper. Men and women. I have no problems whatever with the male gender and the so-called patriarchy. I think misogyny is a much over-played hand. And I know that women were happier when Men walked the earth (in chickified California) and Honor and Chilvary actually still existed. (in California)

    Where am I going with this? Don’t really know….thank you for any support but just know that I have a healthy self-regard and I think my opinions are recently more often right than wrong. (I kick myself for supporting McCain and Romney is an opportunist)

    I don’t have quite the thirst the male gender on ATW has for the constant bickering, though – and they say women talk to much?

    I do wonder if Mahons and Phantom have retracted the Russians are Coming silliness yet?

  99. “It simply didn’t happen.”

    My boots on the ground say that it did. What do you base your facts on, Phantom? CNN? Media Matters? the fake fact checker, Snopes?

  100. Phantom: “What have I said about Russia that you take issue with?”

    I repeat: “I don’t have quite the thirst the male gender on ATW has for the constant bickering, though”

  101. Phantom: so you have nothing real about your claim that the truckers sat on the supplies ? just you spouting nonsense?

    My claim was based on people actually in PR, plus photos and news reports.

    Pathetic.

  102. oops…..should read, Truckers DID NOT sit on supplies.

    I’m hurrying out. Bicker with yourself.

  103. Fox host Shepard Smith debunked a false claim Wednesday that was propagated by his own colleagues just days earlier. Right-wing media had reported that hurricane relief supplies in Puerto Rico were not being distributed because the truck drivers on the island were on strike. Smith called the claim “fake news,” noting that “there is no trucker’s strike” and that “the truckers in Puerto Rico are victims too.”

    Fox News’ Julie Banderas said on “America’s News Headquarters” last week that “the truckers, the Puerto Rican employees, are on strike.” President Donald Trump seemed to have circulated the news when he told a pool of reporters that truck drivers were not doing enough to get the supplies to victims of the hurricane.

    Fortunately for Fox News viewers, Smith fact checked Banderas and the president.

    “Of course, the president mentioned the truckers,” Smith said on his show. “The biggest problem on the island is distribution of supplies, we’re told. Getting needed goods to people outside San Juan has been extremely challenging. According to our reporters on the ground, many of those who would move the supplies have lost their homes and vehicles in the storm. Some of the truckers can’t be reached because there’s no communication working in so many areas still.”

    https://www.salon.com/2017/10/04/shepard-smith-debunks-fake-news-that-puerto-rican-truck-drivers-are-on-strike/

  104. Phantom: “What have I said about Russia that you take issue with?”

    I repeat: “I don’t have quite the thirst the male gender on ATW has for the constant bickering, though”

    Phantom appears to struggle with one woman.

    Imagine him living with five of them?.

  105. charlesintexas, on March 8th, 2018 at 5:40 PM Said:
    What ATW needs is a Ladies Night. We need more chicks in here! 🙂

    Charles.

    It’s ladies, night, day, morning, afternoon, and evening, here everyday of the week, 365 days a year.

    Apart from when I am travelling on business.

    The last time I actually got a word in edgeways was many, many moons ago.

    😏

    I love women, they rule the world.

    Phantom, take note, you can’t stay single all your life, and apart from that, living with widow palm and her five daughters, will eventually make you go blind you know!.😏

  106. Phantom: so you have nothing real about your claim that the truckers sat on the supplies ? just you spouting nonsense?

    Let’s be brutally honest, in the real world, who could be so sad, as to actually give a fuck?.

  107. Patty, on March 8th, 2018 at 5:32 PM Said:
    I happen to love men – it’s raining men, hallelujah

    Patty.

    When are you free for dinner.

    😁

  108. Yes, play the ball. Always. But there is no ball in the case of Puerto Rican truckers refusing to work in the aftermath of a huge catastrophe. It simply didn’t happen.

    You have NO PROOF it did not happen.

    And conservative treehouse is one of the most fact checked and verified sites on the Web because it is under constant attack due to who owns it…. which is also why YOU dismiss it.

    Your precious NYT and WAPO are wrong over 30% of time and base 70% of their “news” on unnamed sources.

  109. My God Phantom..

    I bet you are a hit with the ladies on a night out!. 😏

    You are a red blooded New Yorker American…. apparently?.

    It’s “Me love you long time” not “Me moan at you long time”.

  110. Harri

    Just trying to get it right.

    Playing the ball in a fact based way, like the man said.

    Cheers!

  111. Occasionally one of stomps on Allan, but only occasionally and no one but me and Patty calls Phantom on his bull….

    I’m afraid it’s not bull Pat. A cursory search shows that I have robustly challenged Allah on his rubbish numerous times in the last few weeks alone and that Phantom and I have frequently crossed swords on mostly the EU and the immigration crisis 2015.

    You have NO PROOF it did not happen.

    Pat, Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat

  112. Phantom, on March 8th, 2018 at 6:05 PM Said:
    Harri

    Just trying to get it right.

    Well you are not getting it right, not when it comes to women anyway, maybe that is why you are still single?.

    Women like a barrel full of love and laughs, not a barrel full of political boredom, in reality whoever is right, no-one living in the real world, could actually give a fuck?.

    Patty is all woman as far as I can make out from this far away, and reslly couldn’t give a fuck even less.

    And fair play to her.

  113. Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat

    Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz…yawnity yawn yawn.

    Really…how interesting…..

    Borrrriiiinngg.

    😏

  114. Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat

    See, Google translate does work?.

    Putting aside the translation distaster, (or faux pas) as some would have you believe, of trying to be clever, Latin is easy really.

    😏

  115. My favourite Patty fantasy post was the one about Texas being over thrown by Mexican drug cartels and were killing people on site. That one was so ridiculous it could have been invented by Alan

  116. Harri I am an atheist and a capitalist

    And I usually skip right over the nonsense allan posts so I missed the spelling

  117. Harri I am an atheist and a capitalist

    Hello brother. (Actually, I prefer Apathetic).

    And I usually skip right over the nonsense allan posts so I missed the spelling

    More fool you.

  118. Onus probandi incumbit ei qui dicit, non ei qui negat

    See, Google translate does work?.

    It’s a legal maxim.

    And I usually skip right over the nonsense allan posts so I missed the spelling

    More fool you .

    Yes, the master must be adored.

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