This will be an open thread on the story of Amanda Knox who had been convicted in an Italian Court for the murder of her roomate. Although the story has been a headline one for a while, I haven’t followed it sufficiently enough to offer an informed opinion. Therefore, I’ll turn to our readers – what do you think about this one?
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34 thoughts on “Can Someone Explain the Amanda Knox Story?”
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Court found her guilty. So she is.
She’s probably as innocent as OJ was.
One of those ‘filler’ stories, used when either news is quiet, or when there is real news to be covered-up or otherwise swept under the carpet.
Personally, having lost any degree of trust or belief in the integrity of the press, I favour the latter option, not too farfetched an idea considering the very real news, such as the EU financial fiasco here, or the ‘Fast and Furious’ scandal in the US.
Of course it might just be the season for court cases, especially televised ones, as ‘Our Betters’ are, at this time, considering the advisability of allowing cameras in the courtrooms here in the UK. Or of course it might be that America has its Michael Jackson court drama on 24/7, so the UK, not to be outdone gives us Amanda Knox.
“Court found her guilty. So she is.”
Therefore OJ was innocent!
Mahons, she was convicted on circumstantial evidence and some very flaky forensics.
Oh, and shes a babe!
The truth is impossible for us to know.
Guilty as hell.
Her story has changed repeatedly and includes elements that simply don’t make sense unless she was covering up a crime.
The interest in the case is because she is quite attractive. The focus on her sex life has been gratuitous though not completely irrelevant as the prosecution think it explains the motive for the killing.
Her demeanor at the hearings that I saw seemed odd, not like an innocent person but rather a sociopathic one. However, demeanor isn’t proof. Looks like a complete tabloid cluster you know what. Sadly, the fact that one young woman is dead won’t change.
The court found that Knox, her boyfriend and some African drifter committed the murder together during some sex game.
The main evidence against Knox, that still suggests her guilt, is her own behaviour and her statements after the murder.
She first claimed she was in her boyfriend’s flat all that night, then switched to saying she was in her own house (where Ms. Kercher was murdered) and saw the murderer entering her room and heard screams etc., then reverted to her original story that she was in her boyfriend’s house and didn’t arrive home till the next day.
When she was in seeing-the-murderer mode, she identified him as her own boss, a black guy who ran a cafe where she worked. She stuck to this line for several weeks, even after the guy had been arrested, and only dropped it when the cops had proven conclusively that her boss was somewhere else at the time, at which point she returned to the story that she was not in the house at the time.
Her co-accused African drifter is of course also black, and it’s fairly obvious that she was trying to divert the blame from him to some African look-a-like. However, after the drifter had confessed to the murderer (and saying Knox took part too), Knox switched to saying only he was guilty and she was not at home at the time.
The morning after the murder, Knox and boyfriend were standing outside the house and making a lot of phone calls. In one, she called another flatmate and told her the windows were smashed in and she’d seen blood on the floor but couldnt find Kercher (whose body had been laid under a duvet). She later called her mother in Seattle, who told her to call the cops. She didnt call the cops until an hour after she’d apparently “discovered” the scene. Rather strange.
Later that day – after she’d seen her flatmate murdered in her room – she went to buy sexy undies with her boyfriend and was filmed laughing and kissing him in the store. When she was taken in for questioning, the cops noted that she was in a jolly mood, doing yoga on the police station floor etc. This on the day her “friend’s” murdered body was found in Knox’ flat. Kercher’s other mates say the 2 girls had big issues with living together, and Kercher didnt approve of Knox’ many male friends and sex toy collection in her flat etc.
The African drifter, who confessed, also confirmed that the two didnt get along, and that the sex game was started because Knox, boyfriend and he felt angry at the too-prim and chaste Kercher and wanted to have some fun with her.
The full truth is of course impossible to know, as Phantom said. But Knox is at the very least guilty of telling serious lies, unnecessarily incriminating another man who she knew was not guilty, and continuing with her fiction long after the initial trauma was passed and dropping it only when she had no choice.
At any rate she seems to have been part of sex game during which her flatmate was murdered.
The question I raised before was how, agrainst this background, the US media is generally sympathic their fellow American, reporting on her gallent fight for justice, etc.
Have a look at this:
http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/news/the-neverending-nightmare-of-amanda-knox-20110627
Noel – Kinda funny because Rolling Stone magazine is a mainstream liberal magazine (it is now really a schill for the entertainment industry as its counterculture roots are subject to the whims of the moment). You would usually have to use a flame thrower to get them to side with a white defendant against a non-white one.
I haven’t really watched this enough to get a sense of where the media has come down on this, if at all. The tabloid aspect seems to be sadly typical.
“The question I raised before was how, against this background, the US media is generally sympathetic their fellow American, reporting on her gallant fight for justice, etc.”
Because the USA (The greatest country in the world) has the best legal system in the world stupid!
Being white, rich and good looking means that she would not be found guilty in her home country.
Matt – I think the US media focus would be based not on guilt or innocence so much as the fairness of the process. You’ll find most nations’ governments and media tend to look at that angle quite closely when a citizen is tried and convicted abroad.
Personally I found the case of the West Memphis Three for more interesting, and disturbing.
Three teenagers in Arkansas were convicted, one sentenced to death, for the murder of three young boys. There was no ” evidence ” at all, no DNA, no witness, no placing them at the scene. Nothing, only the testimony of one of the three convicted, a retarded man who is believed to have told the police what they wanted to hear.
There was a rush to find someone who had done these crimes, and these three were teenagers with long hair who liked to listen to heavy metal, it was obvious that they must have done it! As part of a Satanic Ritual must have been!
They were recently freed under some bizarre agreement whereby they were forced to formally accept guilt while maintaining their innocence.
Two of the three, including Damien Echols who had been set to die by lethal injection, were on the Piers Morgan CNN show last night. Compelling viewing and it should be rebroadcast. If you’re for the Death Penalty, and have an open mind, this show might change your mind.
It is obvious that many innocent people are convicted, and that some have been executed. I think that anyone who breezily supports capital punishment without much thought, such as Rick Perry, is unsuited for office.
Mahons,
I was being sarcastic (as usual).
The USA, in my opinion is particularly xenophobic however.
God damn this thing – can’t edit
The links I meant to include are
The support site for the West Memphis Three
http://www.wm3.org/
Wiki entry on Damien Echols
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Damien_Echols
Actually I’ve just seen that the author of the RS article (“Knox also didn’t realize that she would be judged by her behavior, her looks and her nationality. Nor did she suspect that her faith in human nature was a dangerous fantasy.”) is an American writer of fiction.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathaniel_Rich_%28novelist%29
Matt- American xenophobia is of course a cherished belief among the Irish left, whose self-satisfaction in this belief allows them to ignore the pervasive xenophobia of their countrymen. I’ve lived in urban New York and the deep South of the US and have never heard the kind of resentment and language used to describe immigrants and blacks that passes for tea chat in Ireland.
I don’t suppose we’ll ever know whether she’s innocent or guilty and as it’s dragged on so long anything could be the verdict. One thing’s for sure they were all engaged in some dubious practices although I agree this doesn’t prove she’s a murderer but someone did it and the African is already behind bars.
Phantom,
These three were poor, stupid and one was retarded. If they were black as well then they definitely would have got the chair (or however they do it in Arkansas).
I think you know my thoughts on the death penalty in the USA from previous posts.
It is obscene.
Like you, Mahons, I find this story very odd.
Recently, I asked an Italian girlfriend in her mid 30’s what she thought about Amanda’s guilt.
She doesn’t know what happened of course because she wasn’t there but she guesses that drugs were involved – either date rape or otherwise – drugs would certainly would explain the bizarre nature of the crime and Amanda’s lying the next day.
It is obscene.
Because some cops / witnesses lie or make mistakes and prosecutors can and do malicously prosecute and half the jurors are idiots.
I used to be for the Death Penalty. After thinking it through, I can’t possibly support in this country anymore.
Not due to any qualm on its implementation on the truly guilty. I’d pull the switch on them myself with a clear conscience. But the system is often corrupt, and those who, like Perry, support assembly line Death Penalty are in reality in support of killing some innocent along with the guilty.
Mahons,
I’m sure you are right about the Irish Left and I wouldn’t excuse the Irish Right either but neither believes that all things Irish are better than anyone else which is the point I was making.
There would be very very very few Americans who think that everything US is better than what is to be found elsewhere these days.
That may have been true in say the 1950s but for anyone who wants to claim that people think that way now, I want to hear some specifics.
If anything we’ve gone too far the other way. There is a crisis if confidence in America ( and Europe ) these days– a feeling that the culture and economy and personal fortunes are in a permanent downward roll — and that’s at least as bad as having too much confidence.
Matt – Americans who think that way are primarily in movies or running for the Republican nomination.
I think Knox and her ex-boyfriend Sollecito are both guilty as accessories to murder, even if they didn’t wield the knife. There is enough evidence for the convictions to stand and I will be surprised if they don’t.
Understandably, the Italians have reacted badly to US criticisms of their judicial system. After all, their Prime Minister has been embroiled in criminal actions for almost a year now. Would that have happened in France, or Britain?
“American xenophobia is of course a cherished belief among the Irish left, …the kind of resentment and language used to describe immigrants and blacks that passes for tea chat in Ireland.”
I hope you don’t mean the “Irish left” is particularly guilty of that!
The hard stuff against immigrants and blacks – whether in Ireland, the UK or the US – is very much the preserve of the Right, as can be seen on this site day in, day out. I’ll name names if you like.
I think you’re also wrong about American defensiveness and mere concern for foreign legal procedures. The US media had weighed in on Knox’s behalf even before the case had come to trial “American girls fight for justice in Europe”, I remember a CNN headline ran. They only switched to criticising the Italian justice system after it had found Knox guilty, when it was either that or admit that those prosecuting an American abroad can be right.
“drugs would certainly would explain the bizarre nature of the crime and Amanda’s lying the next day.”
I mentioned that “Amanda” continued lying, and changing her lies, for weeks afterwards, even after she had been long in custody, and only stopped when they were proven to be lies. Must have been some drug dose to explain that!
Noel – I meant that the charge of American xenophobia is a cherished belief of the Irish left. Particularly.
And they are uninclinded to examine xenophobia (or other unpleasant things) that are not “on message”.
How the Noam Chomsky set see America.
And that’s when they’re in a generous mood!
“I meant that the charge of American xenophobia is a cherished belief of the Irish left. Particularly.”
Mahons, I love the thought of you Lefties being as bigoted as the rest of us.
Please supply references, etc.
Matt – I’m not aware of my bigotry, but if you wish to confess to something let it all hang out.
Mahons,
Do you Lefties have your sense of humor removed at birth or do you wait until you are older so that you can make your own decision in a PC sort of way?
P.S.
Don’t ask me to explain the above. It will not reflect well on you!
Matt – I’m uncertain as to the sense of humor surgical protocols for lefties. I would imagine they wait until they are older so it can be decided on in a committe setting. I suppose some of them do undergo the procedure of having all or part of their sense of humor removed, but if they didn’t have them removed where would people like you look for sense of humor donors?
As for myself I’ve maintained a rather robust sense of humor since birth, and it has served me well as I encounter the various ins and outs of this life.
Do you Lefties have your sense of humor removed at birth or do you wait until you are older so that you can make your own decision in a PC sort of way?
Yeah Matt, you’re just a barrel of laughs, that’s for sure. You have never been known to post anything remotely angry or hateful or mysogonistic. In fact, you put all us humourless lefties to shame, and prove with
almostevery comment you make that humour is totally reserved to funnymen Righties like yourself.Thanks Peter,
As this is your comment, I take it as a compliment.
Noel’s summary of the case pretty much explains why it is so difficult to believe she’s innocent.
One of the best columns on Amanda Knox is this by Ann Coulter. Because Ann Coulter is Ann Coulter it will probably be ignored but when she does what she made her name doing- sharp writing about legal issues- she is devastatingly effective:
At least until she goes into character and makes out that Knox is a liberal icon and the new Mumia (Knox seems to have plenty of supporters on the right too).