20 1 min 2 yrs

The Cleveland Indians baseball team have announced that they will change their name.

For most of the past 100 years, the franchise had as an logo a image of a grinning Indian, “ Chief Yahoo “. He appeared on uniforms and elsewhere. He was withdrawn in 2018.

I believe that many Indians are not offended by the use of Indian images and names for sports teams, but some are. These names and images are seen as hugely disrespectful. I don’t disagree.

Now the Cleveland Indians name joins Chief Wahoo and the Washington Redskins as part of the past.

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20 thoughts on “Cleveland Indians No More

  1. Sad and ridiculas

    Hey Phantom you know what’s even sadder ? here

    New York City’s famed 21 Club restaurant will be “indefinitely ceasing operations,” a restaurant union president told CNN.

    Bill Granfield, president of the Unite Here Local 100 labor union, says he received a letter on December 9 stating the restaurant is closing and all employees will be permanently terminated on March 9, 2021. The union represents 120 of the restaurant’s approximately 140 workers, according to Granfield.
    The 21 Club closed on March 16 due to the Covid-19 pandemic and has not reopened.
    “In light of the ongoing global crisis and anticipated extended recovery period for the hospitality industry, it has become clear that it will not be feasible to reopen this business in its current form for the foreseeable future,” Belmond, 21 Club’s owners, said in a statement. “The company is committed to exploring potential alternative and transformative structural opportunities that will allow 21 Club to remain a viable operation in the long term, while retaining its distinctive character.”

    Screw those 140 Union workers and screw that restaurant. They might pass on or catch a cold.

  2. Phantom.

    I might be being naive here because I know f*** all about sport.
    What was actually offensive about these teams, what is the team names or the logos they used?

  3. I think that in the case of the Cleveland Indians the name was indelibly associated with the grinning parody of an Indian , seen as a mockery rather than a tribute

    The name IMO wasn’t much seen as derogatory as the name Redskins in the NFL was seen to be

    But there is a general distaste to all these Indian names of teams , which were not set up by any Indians

    I had lunch at the 21. Good place. Hope that it returns at some point.

    The problem here isn’t the no indoor dining rule. The problem is that people don’t want to eat indoors when there’s a deadly virus like this about. Business was slow, as business was mostly slow in other restaurants here anyway

  4. Bull open the restaurants I’ll bet you you’ll have a hard time getting a reservation. and not because of covid seating, open them fully up and you still won’t be able to get a table.

  5. The restaurants were open to 25% indoor capacity until last night.

    Quite a few were not doing good business at all.

  6. Cheers for explaining Phantom.
    I’m guessing the term redskins to refer to native Americans is offensive in the same way that referring to African Americans as coloured is.

  7. Yes

    Though coloured Was not seen as offensive until recent times.

    “ Redskins “ Would often at any time be seen as a term of contempt.

    Others – the Notre Dame ( college ) football leprechaun mascot, the Boston Celtics, the Minnesota Vikings aren’t seen as bad.

    But the Indian symbols were seen as mock tributes aimed at a defeated people who had been the victims of a genocide.

  8. Phantom, on December 14th, 2020 at 1:50 PM Said: Edit Comment
    The restaurants were open to 25% indoor capacity until last night.

    Quite a few were not doing good business at all.

    Yes because so many people had all that stimulus money to pay their bills they could have gone out to eat everyday…..

    Restaurants and Bars are a frivolous industry we don’t need them. 160,000 have gone out of business this year. Almost half of a million people have lost their jobs…. fuck those people.

  9. “Others – the Notre Dame ( college ) football leprechaun mascot, the Boston Celtics, the Minnesota Vikings aren’t seen as bad.”

    Not least because they were adopted by communities from which the mascot or emblem is drawn from. There is obviously a huge number of people of Irish extraction in Boston, and Massachusetts in general. So it is a celebration of the people who will support the team. The same with the Minnesota Vikings. Minnesota is pretty much the centre of Scandinavian American settlement within the United States. The majority of the priests who founded Notre Dame were Irish, and a Notre Dame president was the chaplin of the 69th New York Infantry – the Fighting Irish.

    So all of the nicknames and mascots mentioned reflected the community that they came from. That is simply not the case with Native American imagery within American sports. The Indians, the Redskins, the Chiefs, the Braves, the Blackhawks, none of them were founded by Native Americans or have a particularly big following amongst Native Americans.

  10. Seamus

    That’s correct.

    The Indian names were in a way kind of a mockery of a defeated people.

    The connections between Notre Dame University with Irish America and Ireland itself are deep and enduring. There are partnerships with Trinity and Queens University.

    Notre Dame is a special place, with alumni and admirers in all parts of the US.

    https://studyabroad.nd.edu/programs/dublin-tcd/

    https://pure.qub.ac.uk/en/activities/university-of-notre-dame-3

  11. //that is simply not the case with Native American imagery within American sports. The Indians, the Redskins, the Chiefs, the Braves, the Blackhawks, none of them were founded by Native Americans //

    Not necessarily bad. I can’t remember how many US tanks I saw on parades in Berlin with Indian insignia – headdress, totem poles, spears and the like – painted on the hull or hanging on wires from the turret. It was obvious they were celebrating the Indian tradition of bravery, dash and daring etc., not jeering at it. I also don’t remember ever seeing an Indian looking face among those forces. Most of the guys sitting atop with big grins on their faces and casually blowing kisses to the protesting and screaming students seemed to be blacks.

  12. Speaking of which, one of the electors today is Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot.
    Is he a redskin, with a name like that?

    It’s also a gas to see Hilary and Bill Clinton among the electors from NYS electing Biden.

    (posted in error elsewhere)

  13. Donald Trump has slammed the reported decision by Cleveland’s Major League Baseball team to “Indians” from their name, saying it is “cancel culture at work”.

    The team from Cleveland, Ohio, will change the moniker that has long been associated with racial insensitivity towards Native Americans, in a move first reported by the New York Times.

    Mr Trump, who previously criticised the Washington NFL franchise for dropping “Redskins” from its name, said the move was “not good news” for Indians as well.

    Trump tweeted: “Oh no! What is going on? This is not good news, even for ‘Indians’. Cancel culture at work!”

    Independent

    Does the US president have to speak about everything under the sun? Can’t he focus on his job even for a minute?

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