106 3 mins 2 yrs

A Federal Protective Services officer has been killed in protests after two officers suffered gunshot wounds in California.

Two Federal Protective Service officers were shot during a protest in Oakland in California on Friday night, police told CNN. One of the officers died from his injuries.  “Two Federal Protective Services officers stationed at the Oakland Down Town Federal Building suffered gunshot wounds. Unfortunately, one succumbed to his injury,” the police department said in a statement.

No one will know this Officers name, no one will set up a GoFundMe Page, and more important NO ONE will burn and rob over his death.

These Riots have nothing to do with race.

The death of George Floyd, who was killed by police officer Derek Chauvin was a tragedy. A Tragedy acknowledged by ALL. There were no separation of sides. No closing of ranks. The death of this man in this manner was condemned by everyone on all sides. The country was United in the condemnation.

That Unity was lost as soon as the Riots began. Riots are not Protests. Burning and Robbing are not Protests. Riots in cities not involved in the incident are not Protests. This an organized front of paid Provocateurs whose only goal is chaos.

This is only going to escalate. The only way to stop it is going to be violence directed against those breaking the Law.

It worked in Philly under Rizzo, it worked in NY under Giuliani. You use the Police the way they were meant to be used. You deploy the Riot tactics. Horses, and snow fences to isolate the crowds and then you isolate the very few individuals that are provoking the violence, and arrest them. It works. It has worked every time it is used.

When you allow RIOTERS to “vent” you are not relieving the pressure, you are pouring gasolene on the Fire.

It is now time for not the THREAT of violence from the Police, but the organized application of it. Once it has reached the point it is now at the only way it ends is with force, and force will be applied.

 

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106 thoughts on “George who ?

  1. No one will know this Officers name, no one will set up a GoFundMe Page, and more important NO ONE will burn and rob over his death

    Most probably not. After all, killing by gunshot is an everyday occurance in the US and he died doing the job he was paid to do.

    What I’m pretty sure there will be however is a swift investigation into his murder and should the identity of the suspect be known he’ll be immediately arrested, investigated and if appropriate charged. Had that been done with the killer of George Floyd the last point of your claim above would have been nullified.

    America seems to be broken.

    This an organized front of paid Provocateurs whose only goal is chaos.

    There it is, creeping in again. Who pays them Pat and what is the hourly rate?

  2. The riots have a great deal to do with race, even if white gluten shunning trendies have played a big part in them.

    No one has any right to riot at any place at any time.

    They should be suppressed by whatever means are necessary, by business owners, home owners, and the authorities.

  3. Floyds Killer did get a swift investigation into his murder and the suspect was immediately arrested, investigated and charged.

  4. That’s shameless, absolute fake news Pat. He wasn’t arrested until four days later.

  5. George who?

    George Floyd. He was killed by a police officer, who now faces murder and manslaughter charges.
    Just because someone else killed a police officer in the ensuing riots shouldn’t detract from that fact, and your title suggests you are now demoting his killing to one that isn’t as important as the killing of said police officer.
    Your point about police using more robust methods to end a riot may be a valid one, but you muddy the waters of your argument by appearing to create a hierarchy of victims.

  6. you are now demoting his killing to one that isn’t as important as the killing of said police officer

    That’s because it is not……

    Mr Floyds Death was tragedy, the Police officers Death was a Murder/Assassination.

    One died by excessive force used during an arrest. The other was ambushed with Gun Fire standing in front of a Federal Building in a completely different city over 1000 miles away.

    The fact that you are unable to differentiate between the two shows that you have no grasp of the situation, and a bent moral code.

  7. That’s a false moral equivalance Pat.

    While we don’t know the specifics about the FPO being killed:

    Two Federal Protective Services officers stationed at the Oakland Down Town Federal Building suffered gunshot wounds. Unfortunately, one succumbed to his injury

    https://edition.cnn.com/us/live-news/george-floyd-protests-05-30-20/h_e9837e22d597b46b3562f2e9281edaad

    We’ll assume it’s a crime. Both are crimes of a similar degree.

    Seimi’s correct. You’r attempting to create a heirarchy of victims.

  8. A bent moral code? Fuck you, Troll. You’re the one who thinks one man’s murder is less important than another’s.

  9. America seems to be broken.

    “God bless America”

    God bless America, land that I love
    Stand beside her and guide her
    Through the night with the light from above

    From the mountains to the prairies
    To the oceans white with foam
    God bless America, my home sweet home

    God bless America, land that I love
    Stand beside her and guide her
    Through the night with the light from above
    From the mountains to the prairies
    To the oceans white with foam

    God bless America, my home sweet home
    From the mountains to the prairies
    To the oceans white with foam

    God bless America, my home sweet home
    God bless America, my home sweet home

    How’s that working out?

    This is stretching “works in mysterious ways” to levels way beyond wearing a religious tin-foil hat.

  10. George Floyd at least did not die in vain.

    The leftists are currently stocking up on free 55” flat screen TV,s, Louis Vitton luxury goods, and free Chemist looted supplies of OxyContin.

    Those black areas, and communities are just so deprived, those deprived think trashing an already deprived area into Mogadishu is somehow a good idea.

    You can take the person out of Africa, but not Africa out of the person.

    Dumb fucks.

  11. PVR is right.

    No he isn’t, but thanks for your well phrased, insightful contribution.

  12. You can take the person out of Africa, but not Africa out of the person.

    I would doubt if more than a tiny handful of the people carrying out these criminal acts were born in Africa, but don’t let that stop your full-blown Gammon rant.

  13. Semi I.

    You are hideously white, you rage ranypt and rave.

    And most of this glorious day it seems.

    Stop being such an angry old white man..you gammon.

    It’s been a wonder, glorious day out there.

    I hope you have been keeping well, and safe, and soaking up the vitamin D.

    Can you get an internet connection in your garden?

  14. Harri, if you check the dictionary, under the word Gammon, is a picture of you. You are the textbook definition of a Gammon.
    How have you managed to shoehorn me into that definition?

  15. Seimi, on May 30th, 2020 at 7:15 PM Said:
    So not Africans then?

    So..

    African Americans then?

  16. Harri, I have spent a good part of the day in my back garden, engaged in some woodcarving. I haven’t felt angry even once. I also don’t consider myself to be ‘hideously white,’ whatever you might mean by that.
    As per usual, whatever point you may be trying to make is hidden in nonsense.

  17. Seimi, on May 30th, 2020 at 7:17 PM Said:
    Harri, if you check the dictionary, under the word Gammon, is a picture of you. You are the textbook definition of a Gammon.
    How have you managed to shoehorn me into that definition?

    Semi.

    I think you will find the definition of a Gammon, is white, middle aged, and angry..

    “Fuck you PA troll”

    😀

    Semi I.

    You are a Gammon…get over it mate.

    Welcome to the club, you angry old hideously white man.

    😉

  18. “Fuck you PA Troll”

    No, not angry, not even for a second. 😉

    What have you been whittling today Seimi?

    I have been making yet even more vegetable boxes..

    All out of old recycled timber and old pallets.

  19. So..

    African Americans then?

    So, Americans then? Of African descent. But not Africans? Therefore making your

    You can take the person out of Africa, but not Africa out of the person.

    statement all the more peculiar, as these particular Americans were not taken out of Africa – their ancestors were.

    Or are you trying to make the point that descendants of indigenous Africans, separated by generations from their ancestors, are prone to stealing, looting and generally breaking the law, just like their aforementioned ancestors?
    If that’s the bizarre point you’re trying to make, could you back it up by showing evidence that the original, indigenous Africans were prone to the same law-breaking, looting, stealing habits before they were put in chains and brought to America?
    Perhaps that’s why they were in chains in the first place – they were under arrest. I’m sure you will enlighten us all with your proof.
    Please show us your evidence.

  20. By the way..

    The term “Gammon”

    Unfortunately, it now has about as much effect as the term “racist”.. sadly, the left have done it to actual boring death, it has absolutely no meaning anymore..

    Reference ATW, you can thank, Percy, Jude, and now known as Kurt for that one.

    😉

  21. So, Americans then? Of African descent. But not Africans? Therefore making your

    So..

    African Americans.

    😉

  22. Perhaps that’s why they were in chains in the first place

    So…

    I think your liberal white guilt chains are as just as heavy..and a burden.

    😏

  23. Seimi.

    Putting your bile-away for a second or two..

    What have you been working on whittling away today?

  24. My response to Troll, if you actually read it in context, was to his implication that I was ‘morally bent.’ Other than that I wish the man nothing but goodness in life.

    As to my carving – I’m really just messing around with pieces of timber and logs/branches I pick up on my daily walks. I recently got a new Dremel, and decided to get some woodcarving burrs, and I’ve carved a few faces etc. It’s relaxing and extremely therapeutic. I’ve also now purchased an angle grinder and some carving discs, just to go up a level!

    Good to see you back as a regular on ATW, by the way Seimi.

    Thanks. I’m still playing it by ear, but it’s fun so far.

  25. Seimi.

    I delved into the darkness of my long forgotten parts of my workshop I erected some years back, you know how it goes, it all starts off so neat, well organised and tidy, give it a while, and you couldn’t find that thing you need for all the tea in Wuhan.

    Only today, I found a full set of Dremel bits and bobs I had bought for me as a present from a few years back.

    Now, here where we live there is more spare wood, logs, Oak, Ash, and fruit wood, than 5neir is in Epping forest, it’s all free, and rich for the pickings before it all starts to rot.

    Instead of burning it every by the cubic metres each and every year, I would dearly love the energy, time and actual skill to use the timber to make something.

    I remember at school, turning an old block of wood, on a lathe into a fruit bowl, I think it’s still floating around the house somewhere?

    I know Dave has some enviable skills as a carpenter, it’s a knack I think.

    Seimi.

    I have a chainsaw, which is 24 cc’s more powerful than my first moped (a Yamaha FSI 50cc) it makes pretty short work of cutting logs by the tractor load, I have managed to so far make bird feeding table from a huge blown down aged Oak tree, and a large bird feeding table. All with a chainsaw that will kill you in a moment if you don’t keep your wits about you at all times.

    My brother started out as a carpenter come cabinet maker.

    The skill seems to have missed me and the other brothers. 😏

    But

  26. PVR

    “The death of George Floyd, who was killed by police officer Derek Chauvin was a tragedy. A Tragedy acknowledged by ALL. There were no separation of sides. No closing of ranks. The death of this man in this manner was condemned by everyone on all sides. The country was United in the condemnation.” I agree with that. Once Chauvin was charged all protests should have stopped. The riots are using the murder of Floyd as an excuse. The rioters should be met with appropriate law enforcement and arrested. I also agree that the riots seem to some degree to be organized by malefactors who should be apprehended and charged.

    In some cases protests are understandable but riots are never acceptable.

    But, we should recognize there are problems in some of our police departments and reforms may be needed. In this case Chauvin was a bad apple but not weeded out and that is a problem. From what I have read it seems Minneapolis tried to reform their police department but met some opposition from the police union there. It sounds like the old story of cops sticking up for each other. I’m not against unions, but in the case of police I think they should be restricted to matters of compensation, holidays and the like and not be barred from interfering in personnel matters such as reviews, disciplining, etc. I think there is a conflict of interest there which ill serves the public. I don’t know much about police operations but I can see where the unions might be a problem when a police department attempts to weed out bad apples.

    I believe we also have to recognize that there seems to be a disappropriate number of blacks killed by police in many places across the country. If we say as a nation this could be a problem and we are going to look into it and make changes in need be so that all people are treated fairly by the police, then the murder of Floyd will not have been in vain.

  27. lol…… Ahh did I hit a nerve ?

    Sorry but a criminal who dies resisting arrest is not the same as a cop being Ambushed and murdered.

    Some lives are worth more than others.

    That does not mean that the mans death was justified, it does not mean that his family and friends didn’t love him.

    It means he was a POS criminal who had just passed a fake $20 got caught and died resisting arrest….. excuse me but toooo bad.

    The animal A) shouldn’t have been an Animal, B) Shouldn’t have been committing a crime, and C) shouldn’t have been RESISTING ARREST.

    I have very little sympathy for the criminal. When you choose to be an Animal you are going to have run ins with the Law and guess what….. you can die.

    It is the choice he made.

    And only a fool would equate that death with the intentional ASSASSINATION of a cop.

    So if that offends you….. toooo bad.

  28. What’s really going to piss you all off is when the cop doesn’t get convicted of Murder.

    According to the first autopsy he didn’t suffocate or die from the officers knee on his neck. He died because he had a bad heart that gave out while he was……. wait for it…..

    RESISTING ARREST!

    That’s accidental Manslaughter, NOT Murder…….

  29. You must be hitting the vodka bottle pretty hard to have typed all that.
    On the one hand you say his death wasn’t justified and on the other you laugh at it.
    All these posts do are confirm for everyone, yet again, that you are the only person on this site who glorifies murder. Sleep well.

  30. Riots are, at their core, a choice made by those in power, not people who participate in them. If you build a society that exhausts and abuses people and choose to privilege capital over human life, I’m not sure which other imaginary “civil” options you expect people to exercise

  31. Riots are, at their core, a choice made by those in power, not people who participate in them. If you build a society that exhausts and abuses people and choose to privilege capital over human life, I’m not sure which other imaginary “civil” options you expect people to exercise

  32. Harri

    It sounds like you have the same problem as me

    when it comes to wood working you need to slow down and enjoy the inherent Zen of the moment, I too often want to hasten to the end and my projects bare witness to haste makes waste

  33. oh that’s a load of crap Daphne……

    Seimi the Duality of man it is both a tragedy and amusing……

  34. How is a man being held on the ground for over eight minutes, pleading for his life, until he dies, amusing? Please explain that to me. What exactly about it made you laugh?

  35. nothing about it made me laugh…… What I find amusing is idiots who are shocked when crime leads to death……

    The cop used excessive force, even if the second autopsy shows that his heart gave out like the first one has the cop still is responsible for his death.

    Seimi you say I glorify murder……. bullshit!

    You people can’t tell the difference between someone getting killed resisting arrest, and someone standing there getting gunned down because they are wearing a uniform and you think I’m f’d up…..

    I hold my tongue on this site to keep the peace, I killed the Troll, but when you gits equate the assassination of a cop with that of the death of a criminal resisting arrest I draw the line and vodka has nothing to do with it.

    Like Peter oh if you’re black you haven’t got a chance the cops are going to kill ya… kiss my ass. About 1000 people a year get killed being arrested the majority being white…. Race ain’t got Sh** to do with it.

    When a person decides to act in a criminal manner they throw their lives away, they commit suicide. Most of the time it’s a very slow suicide, but their killing themselves just the same.

    What I find amusing is the shock when their choices lead to their death.

    I have family as we speak standing on the street in 3 major cities across this country right now watching animals rob and pillage all with targets on their chests in the shape of a Badge so excuse me if I disagree with your pitty the criminal view.

  36. tell his family he deserved to die….. no it’s the same, he was black to. I guess he should have expected it.

  37. Less than 12 hours ago, you called a man killed by a police officer an animal and a piece of shit. You have no place in this discussion.
    Your mention of ‘family’ in this post and your naming another post ‘Family’ are examples of Stolen Valor, just like your claims that you ‘served.’ You should be ashamed.
    Changing your profile name on a blog does not change who or what you are. You are the Troll.
    Now, you go have yourself another vodka and a big laugh about someone else’s death, or pretend that some cop or soldier’s death affects you as part of some fraternity you’ve never been in.

  38. Harri
    It sounds like you have the same problem as me
    when it comes to wood working you need to slow down and enjoy the inherent Zen of the moment, I too often want to hasten to the end and my projects bare witness to haste makes waste

    Thanks EP

    I forgot to mention, yesterday (there are two farms here, both same family owned) they are having a large clear out, they have knocked down old barns, buildings etc: they are going to burn the old timbers, I mean huge oak beams and piles of other old timbers.

    I done several trips to the pile and salvaged as much as I could stack down the bottom of the garden, I simply could not bare witness to the farmhands pouring diesel on it and burning all that historic timber.

    As you say, in time, and with a bit more patience, hopefully I can construct something out of some of it.

    Either way, just saving a lot of it from the flames is a worthy cause. I can’t abide wanton waste.

    Cheers.

  39. // hopefully I can construct something out of some of it.//

    I remember when I was collecting wood from the forest in March there were some logs, only about 5 ft long or so, that weighed a ton. I can lift a lot, but getting one of those things over your shoulder was impossible because of the weight, and I had to drag them to the car. I would have loved to know what kind wood they were. It seemed a shame to use all that dense matter as firewood.
    My dad used to be able to tell every type of wood at about 200 yards distance – knew which was best for furniture, which for construction and for firewood etc. All that knowledge died with him unfortunately.

  40. Seimi, on May 31st, 2020 at 7:57 AM Said: Edit Comment
    Less than 12 hours ago, you called a man killed by a police officer an animal and a piece of shit. You have no place in this discussion.
    Your mention of ‘family’ in this post and your naming another post ‘Family’ are examples of Stolen Valor, just like your claims that you ‘served.’ You should be ashamed.
    Changing your profile name on a blog does not change who or what you are. You are the Troll.
    Now, you go have yourself another vodka and a big laugh about someone else’s death, or pretend that some cop or soldier’s death affects you as part of some fraternity you’ve never been in.

    Hey Seimi I don’t discuss the fact that you’re a terrorist sympathizer to keep the peace and because when you are not supporting killers you’re a pretty reasonable guy, but if anyone can’t talk on this subject it’s you.

    Being Proud that my family are COPS in Philly, NY, and Denver and saluting them IS NOT STOLEN VALOR. I am not a cop nor have I claimed to be one.

    I’ve been on Mr Floyds side from day one of this. I have said the cop used excessive force. I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy that the cop should still be prosecuted.

    You suffer from Helsinki syndrome from the environment you grew up in and are not rational on the issues of Police and Soldiers you think masked scum that blow up woman and children are “Soldiers” when they are terrorists.

    It is you who has NO place in this discussion.

  41. Hey Seimi I don’t discuss the fact that you’re a terrorist sympathizer to keep the peace…

    You bring this fallacy up with me and others whenever it suits your narrative. Please be truthful.

    I’ve been on Mr Floyds side from day one of this.

    Right up until the point where you referred to him as a POS criminal, boo-hoo etc etc.

    I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy that the cop should still be prosecuted.

    That’s right. He could have keeled over at any stage. Being held in a hold that is deemed dangerous by most American police forces until he lost consciousness and died had nothing to do with it.

    You suffer from Helsinki syndrome from the environment you grew up in and are not rational on the issues of Police and Soldiers you think masked scum that blow up woman and children are “Soldiers” when they are terrorists.

    Thanks, Dr. Troll. You’re this site’s main supporter of terrorism, but thanks anyway.

  42. I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy that the cop should still be prosecuted.

    Of course the knee on the neck killed him. What a daft thing to say. Or do you believe its just a pure co-incidence that he died on the same day as he had his neck squeezed shut for 8 minutes ?

  43. I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy

    Immaterial. You should familiarise yourself with the eggshell skull doctrine in Tort Law and its ‘take their victims as they find them’ application in criminal law.

  44. Wonderful news!

    Social distancing is officially over….rejoice.

    It’s what George would have wanted…

    Thousands of Black Lives Matter activists march on Downing Street and US embassy in London chanting ‘I can’t breathe!’ and carrying banners calling for ‘justice’ over death of George Floyd in US as large crowds gather in Cardiff and Manchester

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8374007/Hundreds-Black-Lives-Matter-activists-chanting-breathe-gather-Trafalgar-Square.html

  45. EXCLUSIVE: Moment ‘Molotov sister’, 27, ‘throws petrol bomb at police van with four NYPD officers inside’ during George Floyd protests before she was charged with attempted murder and her sibling, 21, was also arrested

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8374165/Moment-Molotov-sister-27-throws-petrol-bomb-police-van-four-NYPD-officers-inside.html

    Samantha Shader, And her sister Darian.

    Guess what group they belong too?

    It starts with A and ends in a.

  46. Majid Nawaz Is a full on liberal with a very large L

    Never thought the day would come when he actually saw sense…I was wrong.

    White-bourgeois Antifa rioters are burning black minority neighbourhoods – Maajid rages

    ACTIVIST and broadcaster Majid Nawaz has suggested that “white-bourgeois Antifa rioters” are to blame for the ongoing riots and violence erupting across America in recent days.

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1289476/George-Floyd-riots-Maajid-Nawaz-Antifa-US-Minneapolis-black-lives-matter-latest

  47. I Suspect we will learn a great deal more about this Shader

    She is from upstate New York, is not a local. She apparently traveled here and and attempted to burn policemen to death.

    Let’s see who her friends are, who she’s been calling and texting this week

  48. Her fellow full on fascists will be crowdfunding her bail as we speak..

    Antifa are the mirror image, and everything they falsely claim to be against.

    Violent thugs and utter misguided charlatans.

    Antifa need to be outed, and decapitated.

  49. Paul was sending an endless number of proactive bejabberings when I and others broached the possibility that “ protesters “ such as Minnesota Umbrella Man might be antifa. He wanted to know who their leaders were, what their organization chart was, etc. He has always minimized the ultraviolent menace of antifa, or that it even exists at all,

    And now we see in plain light antifa molls who are alleged to be involved in a true attempt at murder. It’s pretty hard to read anything else into the act of throwing a Molotov cocktail into an occupied vehicle.

    But maybe the usual suspects can concoct an excuse for this. Maybe antifa does not exist after all. Maybe Those cops deserved it. Or something.

  50. Harri 536

    Spot on

    I am actually in a way sorry that these two young women Have likely ruined their lives. How in gods name could you be so lost That you get into a movement like this, that you do acts like that?

    But then I think of what the one tried to do.

    Let’s see if the usual suspects try to defend her in some way here.

    I could almost write their script for them, and so could you

  51. Antifa USA.

    Facebook.

    ANTIFA, USA
    Yesterday at 01:22 ·
    It’s interesting that cops have super strong unions, but tend to vote for a party that fights so hard against collective bargaining. 😳 F-them… every precinct and station should be turned to ash

  52. No that’s obviously fake news

    Some guy in Spain thinks that organization doesn’t exist in the first place, So how could an organization that doesn’t exist be issuing threats

  53. Colm.

    It’s not what ‘she did.’

    It’s what they do.

    They are crypto facist anarchists.

  54. I did not say that they would

    But Paul and others have made excuses for political Violence and rioting before

  55. I will write their words for them,

    “ We have course condemn the throwing of Molotov cocktails Into occupied police vans. But but but ahem ..on the other hand , “

  56. The antifa (/ænˈtiːfə, ˈæntiˌfɑː/)[1] movement in the United States is a militant, left-wing, anti-fascist political activist movement[7][11] which comprises autonomous activist groups that aim to achieve their political objectives through the use of direct action rather than through policy reform.[12][13][14] Activists engage in varied protest tactics, including digital activism, property damage, physical violence and harassment against those whom they identify as fascist, racist or on the far-right.[22]

    Individuals involved in the movement tend to hold anti-capitalist views,[23] and subscribe to a range of ideologies such as anarchism, socialism, communism, liberalism and social democracy.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifa_(United_States)

    Anarcho-fascism has acquired a cult status with the far left.

  57. Phantom

    I think the point Paul has been making re; his disagreement with you over antifa is not that he is defending them or trying to pretend they are not involved, but he thinks you are giving them far too much credit for their organisational and influential abilities to orchestrate mass violence across America. They may have attached their scraggly coats to the tails of the existing riots but they are not a big enough outfit to influence or catalyse them.

  58. It exists, it is very dangerous, and anyone who says otherwise is either a fool or a liar or both.

  59. Colm, on May 31st, 2020 at 6:02 PM Said:
    Phantom
    Which usual suspects here do you think would defend what she did ?

    I like Colm, he’s harmless enough.

    But, and there is always a but,.

    In this case, deflection and obfuscation.

    It’s not what she did, as expected and as horrific as it is, this is Antifa after all.

    Phantom is merely pointing out some on ATW believing Antifa are not a problem, just some looney fringe far left group..

    No, they are very well funded, well organised, and very violent.

  60. but they are not a big enough outfit to influence or catalyse them.

    As I said, Colm is a decent chap, and is as harmless as a kitten, but at times his marbles are seriously misaligned.

    Less whinging, and more whittling..perhaps?

    Let’s just reiterate what Colm ‘thinks’

    Antifa … “ They may have attached their scraggly coats to the tails of the existing riots but they are not a big enough outfit to influence or catalyse them.”

    Jesus H Christ.

    😏

  61. Colm.

    Is Daphne incorrect?

    Daphne, on May 31st, 2020 at 1:33 AM Said:
    It’s a mix of antifa and white supremacists causing the destruction.

  62. But these guys have not criticized them at all, Over a period of years here.

    This goes far beyond anyone saying that their influence is “ exaggerated”

    I have seen otherwise intelligent left of center people commenting kindly on antifa, Referring to them as some sort of anti-Nazi movement.

    But if you spend 30 minutes reading up about this organization, that’s not what they are at all.

    They are closer in spirit to Nazis or Brownshirts than they are to any true progressives

  63. I have seen otherwise intelligent left of center people commenting kindly on antifa, Referring to them as some sort of anti-Nazi movement.
    But if you spend 30 minutes reading up about this organization, that’s not what they are at all.

    They are closer in spirit to Nazis or Brownshirts than they are to any true progressives

    Precisely.

  64. Yes Harri, I have my own mind, and I don’t just parrot mindless Left or Right slogans which is all you are capable of. I have more respect for Phantom’s opinions although I think it is arrogant of him to claim someone is a liar or a fool just for not exactly sharing his views on Antifa. Your opinions are just cheap laughable rent-a-slogans and it probably won’t be long on this thread before trot out for the 1,456th time that I am a ‘right on fainting liberal’ or that “my head is exploding with righteous anger” – thinking you are being uniquely witty.

  65. Do you get a free tin-foil hat when you join the Antifa army?

    According to Brian Levin, director of the Center for the Study of Hate and Extremism at the California State University, San Bernardino, antifa activists feel the need to participate in violent actions because “they believe that elites are controlling the government and the media. So they need to make a statement head-on against the people who they regard as racist”.[8] According to Mark Bray, the adherents “reject turning to the police or the state to halt the advance of white supremacy. Instead they advocate popular opposition to fascism as we witnessed in Charlottesville”.[25]

  66. Colm.

    Like I said, you really are a likeable chap, not the full shilling, but harmless anyway.

    😉

  67. Colm, on May 31st, 2020 at 6:33 PM Said:
    Yes Harri, I have my own mind,

    A debatable point in question.

    😉

  68. Is Daphne incorrect?

    No I don’t believe she is, not in her use of the term ‘most’. No doubt Antifa, and white nationalist agitators are involved but clearly most of the destruction is still being carried out by unorganised gangs of mostly black rioters and looters.

  69. most of the destruction is still being carried out by unorganised gangs of mostly black rioters and looters.

    Racist.

    😉

  70. Patrick Underwood. Who is that you ask? He is the Federal Officer who was shot dead in Oakland. He happened to be African American.

  71. Patrick Underwood. Who is that you ask? He is the Federal Officer who was shot dead in Oakland. He happened to be African American.

    Antifa will be on that like a flash..

    Or maybe not.

    BLM

    Well, some anyway.

  72. The preliminary autopsy is not a legal conclusion, and the cause of death was not cited as resisting arrest. Anyone who watches the video can clearly see there was no resisting arrest in the minutes before his death. Under Minnesota law murder in the 3rd degree involves a depraved indifference, there is no requirement of premeditation. Accordingly the charge appears warranted.

  73. Do you think that antifa is a significant player in this violence?

    My honest answer. I don’t know. I am not there and cannot measure how much they are involved. I have no doubt they are, but I would tend to the idea that the degree and extent of the violence is not significantly affected by their involvement. If Antifa weren’t involved at all I sill think the vast maJority of the violence we have seen would still have happened. That’s the point I think Paul was trying to make too, but he can correct me if I am mistaken.

  74. Antifa is not an easily defined organization and it’s “members” hail from an assortment of violent left groups, much as white supremists cover a number of groups. It would semi that a lot of rioting is related to some of these agitators, but a lot would be going on in their absence.

  75. No one has said that antifa is a traditionally structured group

    Neither is Al Queda

    All three groups claim to fight oppression By means of violence that they claim to be justified

  76. Maybe, If Petr is around these here parts, he could clear this all up.

    I believe Petr is Antifa?

  77. Paul was sending an endless number of proactive bejabberings when I and others broached the possibility that “ protesters “ such as Minnesota Umbrella Man might be antifa. He wanted to know who their leaders were, what their organization chart was, etc. He has always minimized the ultraviolent menace of antifa, or that it even exists at all,

    And now we see in plain light antifa molls who are alleged to be involved in a true attempt at murder. It’s pretty hard to read anything else into the act of throwing a Molotov

    Now, let me lay out my thoughts on the ‘antifa’ bogeyman.
    cocktail into an occupied vehicle.

    Firstly Phantom let me say this directly, the above is an absolute untruth and you should retract it immediately although I won’t hold my breath

    ‘Antifa’ is an abstract concept of rag bag troublemakers as opposed to some cohesive group. AFAIA the have no leader, no structure, no objective, no political manifesto, no membership mechanism, no chain of command etc and the reason for that is they don’t exist as a cohesive group outside a bogeyman non identifiable tag.

    My coments to you re ‘antfa’ were initially because you posted a video of an alleged provocatuer and suggested it was ‘antifa’ no one else did, no one in the video etc, only you and my reaction to you invoking the ‘antfa’ bogeyman is because of your laziness at seemingly branding any white guy in a riot as the phantom menace hell bent on destroying society, (echoes of something else there).

    If ‘antfa’ exist why don’t the simply arrest its leaders and close it down?

    But Paul and others have made excuses for political Violence and rioting before

    I have never made an excuse for political violence nor rioting. I have never,ever denied my equivical support for political violence when justified.

    And now we see in plain light antifa molls who are alleged to be involved in a true attempt at murder. It’s pretty hard to read anything else into the act of throwing a Molotov cocktail into an occupied vehicle.

    But maybe the usual suspects can concoct an excuse for this.

    Does it state anywhere in the article that these two sisters are ‘antifa’? I’ve skimmed over it and while I may have missed it I suspect you’re projecting your phantom menace onto it as yo did with the provocatuer video but just let me be absolutely direct here again. That girl shouldn’t have done that at all and the action should be unequivocally condemned.

  78. Antifa are a shit storm to the black community.

    WATCH: BLM protester calls out white Antifa for vandalizing local Starbucks

  79. I’ve been witness to many riots, do you know what the number one driver of sustained rioting is? Excitement, rioting is exciting.

  80. I suggested that it might be antifa or that it might be a ( Police ) agent provocateur. Yet you totally freaked out By the first reference but paid no mind to the second.

    And yes you have always made excuses for the political violence directed against ( the small and nonviolent ) Pegida in Dublin.

    Please don’t deny it, people have memories around here

  81. I asked you did anyone else bar you suggest he was ‘antifa’ and then asked you for some information on ‘antifa’ as you’re seemingly the expert on it.

    And yes you have always made excuses for the political violence directed against ( the small and nonviolent ) Pegida in Dublin.

    I told you that if you’re going to say ‘fuck you’ to a Dub in their own city you’re more likely than not going to end up with a sore face. Here’s the thread:

    POLICE BRUTALITY ISN’T ALWAYS BAD

    Incredible dishonesty.

  82. You made excuses for political violence, the words are right there

    And there was nothing spontaneous about it…The attackers hunted down their prey, They didn’t just happen to be there

    Why do the most dishonest people always accuse others of dishonesty? That’s a very Trumper tactic!

    MAGA! How do you say that in Spanish

  83. If you’re going to be aggressive to Dubs in their own city it’s not going to end well.

    You’re incredibley dishonest.

  84. //Why do the most dishonest people always accuse others of dishonesty? //

    🙂

  85. Harri

    //I know Dave has some enviable skills as a carpenter, it’s a knack I think.//

    Thanks Harri. I appreciate that compliment.

    //forgot to mention, yesterday (there are two farms here, both same family owned) they are having a large clear out, they have knocked down old barns, buildings etc: they are going to burn the old timbers, I mean huge oak beams and piles of other old timbers.

    I done several trips to the pile and salvaged as much as I could stack down the bottom of the garden, I simply could not bare witness to the farmhands pouring diesel on it and burning all that historic timber.

    As you say, in time, and with a bit more patience, hopefully I can construct something out of some of it.

    Either way, just saving a lot of it from the flames is a worthy cause. I can’t abide wanton waste//

    That’s really spooky mate. I’ve been doing something similar.
    I’ve got a job to build a wooden former for a brick arch. It doesn’t have to be anything spectacular because it will just be thrown away after it’s used.
    I’ve noticed that a guy I’ve done some work for, who lives in a lovely country house has been filling a skip with waste wood, because he’s having work done on his house at the moment. I asked him could I take some of his old scrap wood out of the skip to make my form and he said yes. While I was doing this, I discovered some old oak beams in the skip. I mentioned to him that they were oak and probably valuable and he said he’s not bothered I can have them. They looked really knackered and crusty on the outside, but after running them through the table saw and taking off about 10mm all round, I’ve got some fantastic old oak beams, probably worth about 200 quid.
    Me and you truly have a womble mentality mate.

  86. Colm, on May 31st, 2020 at 1:44 PM Said: Edit Comment
    I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy that the cop should still be prosecuted.
    Of course the knee on the neck killed him. What a daft thing to say. Or do you believe its just a pure co-incidence that he died on the same day as he had his neck squeezed shut for 8 minutes ?

    Paul McMahon, on May 31st, 2020 at 2:01 PM Said: Edit Comment
    I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy
    Immaterial. You should familiarise yourself with the eggshell skull doctrine in Tort Law and its ‘take their victims as they find them’ application in criminal law.

    My god did both your mothers raise ijits……. ?

    Gentleman

    You need an edumication…… The Officer has been charged with 3rd Degree Murder and Manslaughter,

    There is a reason for the specific 3rd degree charge and a 2nd or 1st. 1st of course is premeditated and carries death as a penalty. 2nd is 45 years, 3rd is 25 years.

    Now there are some things I have not said or entered into conversation about other than Mr Floyd resisted arrest.

    It took 4 days to charge him because they had to wait for the autopsy to charge him correctly.

    If the autopsy had shown that Mr Floyd died of asphyxiation or Trauma to the throat and neck area he would have been charged with 2nd degree. The autopsy showed none of those things. The autopsy showed heart failure, and there were indications before and during the arrest that he was under the influence. The toxicology report is not yet in. But it was the stress off everything that caused him to die by having a heart attack.

    When you combine those details with the fact that multiple witnesses and body cams of all 4 officers show Mr Floyd complaining long before he was put on the ground that he could not breath, that he could not be put in the police car because he was claustrophobic physically resisting stiffening his body so he could not be put in the police car which is how he wound up on the ground.

    Now a good Lawyer that this Officer will have will argue that this pos cop was not responsible for his death. The evidence does not support the media narrative and the false narrative portrayed by the public surveillance film that everyone has saw and when placed in context with the bodycams the film actually shows a much calmer more restrained situation than the events that occured before he was on the ground.

    No one wants this scumbag cop to walk.

    So they charged him with 3rd degree because there is a stipulation in 3rd degree that even though the physical evidence of the current victim does not show the physical signs of murder the person can be charged with murder because he has a history of excessive violence, and his history of excessive violence shows that he had a callous disregard for life.

    And the Manslaughter is the Plea charge.

    So as I have said that even though the Knee on his neck did NOT kill the guy that the cop should still be prosecuted.

    really you must learn to control your emotions.

  87. as for the Antifa chic and her sister they both should have been shot by the officers in self defense.

    The idea that you question that these riots are organized or just how dangerous and well funded Antifa is only shows you’re not paying attention.

  88. Two lawyers were arrested last night in a Molotov cocktail incident.

    One of them is a so-called human rights lawyer. My, what a surprise

  89. I’m afraid that it’s you who needs the education Pat. You need to familiarise yourself with the ‘eggshell skull’ doctrine in tort law and its ‘take your victim as you find them’ application in criminal law.

    I don’t think anyone here has called this murder and IMO there wasn’t sufficient mens rea for a murder charge. A man lost his life and the man suspected of taking his life through physical force was at liberty for four days. I think that’s why you had an outbreak of violence in Minneapolis.

  90. Paul the ‘eggshell skull’ doctrine in tort law is not used in criminal cases here in the US.

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