53 3 mins 5 yrs

Ok, now I’m willing to believe that Russians did it.

Former spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter were poisoned by a military-grade nerve agent of a type developed by Russia, Theresa May has told MPs.

The PM said the government concluded it was “highly likely” Russia was responsible for the Salisbury attack[…]

The chemical used in the attack, the PM said, has been identified as being part of a group of nerve agents known as Novichok.

Mrs May said Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson had told the ambassador Moscow must provide “full and complete disclosure” of the Novichok programme to the Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons by the end of Tuesday.

You always have to beware disinformation and propaganda when Russians are the subject, but this is a blatant accusation, by the Prime Minister, in Parliament. That’s different. If she made a false accusation, knowingly or not, that’s a very serious business, and I don’t think that May is made of that stuff. Her instinct is to soothe feathers, not ruffle them. She must be 100 per cent certain of her facts.

Let’s be clear: the Prime Minister has effectively accused the Russian government of chemical warfare on NATO soil. She cannot now back down if Moscow bluffs it out. It could be that Moscow has lost control of operatives and nerve agent, but pride and ego won’t allow them to admit it if so.

What to do about it is the question, and there’s much that can be done short of military action, which would be stupid. Diplomatically, this level of accusation demands the closure of the Russian Embassy in London and the expulsion of all staff. There’s a lot of dirty Russian money in London and the Home Counties. The Treasury and Bank of England can be tasked with giving its owners a very bad time. Western intel agencies are already meddling in the Russian general election. That can be intensified.

This has the potential to become very messy, but the Prime Minister has made an extremely serious accusation. It has to be backed up.

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  1. It’s the Russians, it’s the Russians..

    Oh look a squirrel!..

    Frank Fisher
    31 minutes ago
    Things I’m not that fussed about: a Russian spy getting whacked.

    Things I do give a shit about: Thousands upon thousands of British kids being raped and abused with the full cooperation of every arm of the british state, and anyone who criticises it gagged, jailed or deported.

    Well said that man.

  2. Harri –

    Sure, just a Russian spy (and his daughter). But I was in Salisbury today. Half the town is shut down. It might be contaminated. Hundreds of Britons might have been contaminated. When Litvinenko was murdered the Polonium trail could be followed through London. It was tracked all the way to a departure gate at Heathrow.

    So just a Russian spy and his daughter are gravely ill in hospital, but I don’t care for anyone contaminating my country and compatriots.

  3. When Litvinenko was murdered the Polonium trail could be followed through London. It was tracked all the way to a departure gate at Heathrow.

    Mores the pity the establishment weren’t as thorough tracking down those paki child rapists.

    I wonder what Agent COB had to say about all this?.

    Not very much I believe, going by the trouncing he got in parliament today.

  4. Well said that man.

    Yes – we’re being pushed into deciding what we really give a shit about and not. And the last sentence is now being proven absolutely correct. Morgoth, of Morgoth’s Review, explains the Paki Rapefest of British girls……..

    And as for a Russian traitor getting offed at a particularly counter-productive moment for a country full of chess-players, yeah, whatever.

    Here are who are allowed into the country and those who are not…….

  5. Pete Moore, on March 12th, 2018 at 6:41 PM Said:

    Harri –

    Sure, just a Russian spy (and his daughter). But I was in Salisbury today. Half the town is shut down. It might be contaminated. Hundreds of Britons might have been contaminated.

    Pete – I don’t believe what the ‘authorities’ are telling me on this matter. These ‘authorities’ are exactly the same as those who made enormous efforts (on-going everywhere else) to cover up the mass rape of our women and are telling us that Russia is the threat! They are lying.

  6. I am not convinced either, this is more than likely pure establishment theatrics for the plebs.

  7. Harri –

    Any minister who lies to Parliament must resign. Think of the seriousness of the Prime Minister’s accusation. Ask yourself if Theresa May, a risk-averse faintheart, is the kind of person to knowingly lie today.

    No way. She might have been led up the garden path, but No.10 will have gone through the intel extremely carefully.

  8. Pete.

    Chairman May is all high & mighty threatening the Russians, she can’t open her mouth quick enough, and loud enough.

    It’s a pity she doesn’t show the same guts dealing with the EU.

  9. No way. She might have been led up the garden path, but No.10 will have gone through the intel extremely carefully.

    Like they did with Blair, and his 45 minutes bullshit?.

    He got clean away on his heels blatantly lying to parliament.

  10. Tony Blair is a casual and habitual liar who absolutely would lie to anyone. He’s a dodgy merchant who gets a thrill from it.

    Theresa May is not like that.

  11. The lady doctor who attended the daughter, has suffered no ill-effects whatsoever?.


    SHE’D STOPPED BREATHING’ Sergei Skripal’s doctor tells of fight to keep poisoned Russian spy’s daughter Yulia alive as nerve agent took hold
    Former spy Sergei Skripal, 66, and his daughter Yulia were found slumped unconscious on a bench in Salisbury on Sunday, with spooks concluding that they were targeted by a nerve agent

    A DOCTOR who fought to save the life of an ex-Russian spy’s daughter in the aftermath of a targeted nerve agent attack has told how she stopped breathing, vomited and went into a fit.


  12. Again.

    How come the lady Doctor in attendance, is not affected in any way?.

    Speaking to the BBC, a doctor told how when they began treating her she was “slumped in her seat, completely unconscious”.

    The doctor, who has not been named, added that she had stopped breathing, and was vomiting.

    Her body then began to go into a fit as the nerve agent took hold.

    Thankfully the doctor got her into the recovery position and managed to clear her airway to get her breathing again.

  13. Think of the seriousness of the Prime Minister’s accusation. Ask yourself if Theresa May, a risk-averse faintheart, is the kind of person to knowingly lie today.

    Think of the seriousness of the Prime Minister – Theresa May is simply a puppet who was placed into the PM slot without any vote on anything, and some here complain about China and Russia!! She’ll do what she is told to do and tell herself that she hasn’t lied but was just doing her job

  14. TWENTY-ONE people have been treated as a result of the ex-Russian spy poisoning, Wiltshire Police have confirmed.

    They include an off-duty doctor and nurse who stopped to help the pair at the scene.

    The doctor, who has not been named, was out shopping when she came across the pair.

    She found Yulia Skripal, 33, slumped over a bench, unconscious, vomiting and having a fit.
    Yulia had also stopped breathing.

    The doctor got Yulia onto the floor and put her in the recovery position, before forcing her airway open so she could breathe.

    Paramedics then arrived and took over the treatement.

    The doctor who gave first aid was concerned she had been affected, but so far is said to be feeling fine.


    So why all the theatrics with chemical suits?.

  15. Interesting development. It is unlikely she took the decision lightly.

    If true, it is a serious error and overreach by the Russian kleptocracy.

    Watch this space.

  16. The Treasury and Bank of England can be tasked with giving its owners a very bad time.

    To enforce the money-laundering laws means going after the large law firms and estate agents who facilitate the acquisition of high-end London property with stolen money. Channel 4 did a brilliant undercover sting a couple of years ago which exposed both lawyers and estate agents, but absolutely no criminal action followed.

    Airport security staff live in fear of undercover operatives from the Civil Aviation Authority posing as passengers in order to test the security screening. Lawyers and estate agents need to live in similar fear. It would just take a few prison sentences for behaviour to change.

  17. And we should also shut down that shameless propaganda TV channel Putin Today, now calling itself RT. Can you imagine the Russians allowing a British version of this in Moscow? What fools we are.

  18. O/T, Three pipe bombs go off in Austin, TX, killing one and injuring two. Daphne will be seriously pissed! Don’t mess with Texas!

  19. Trump’s shameful silence so far is not in the least surprising:

    “The United Kingdom has been left to deal with this matter alone by a U.S. administration that will not respond, even to a Russian WMD attack on NATO soil.

    It’s too early to say that the Trump administration will do nothing. Perhaps it may yet step up. Perhaps it may even calculate that joining the U.K. in sanctions upon Russians implicated in such an outrageous crime may quiet complaints about the Trump administration’s refusal to implement sanctions for Russian meddling in the 2016 election. Those questions remain open. For now, though, we are presented with the most astounding yet Trump default from traditional U.S. alliances and leadership. At Monday’s White House press conference, Sarah Huckabee Sanders rebuffed repeated questions about whether the U.S. even supported the U.K. finding of fact about Russian responsibility.

    As the default continues and expands, the evidence accumulates: Trump simply will not act to protect the U.S. and its allies against even Russian aggression, even on their own territory, even in the form of attempted murder.

    Trump’s inaction speaks louder than any words. It is a confession for all to hear.”


  20. No phone call of support from the White House, not even a tweet. Instead we get this:

    “The White House has declined to endorse the UK government’s assessment that Russia was behind the recent attempted assassination of a former double agent in Salisbury, England.

    On Monday, British Prime Minister Theresa May said it was “highly likely” that the Russian government was behind the attack that has left Sergei Skripal and his daughter Yulia critically ill, calling it “an unlawful use of force by the Russian State against the United Kingdom.”

    But when White House press secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders was asked repeatedly about the incident at a press conference in Washington DC later on Monday, she would not say whether the American government agreed with this attribution, and did not mention Russia by name.”


  21. Ok May has spouted. I’d still like some hard facts in the story. Media speculation is not admissible in court yet. Proper hard evidence before an inquest or before a court of law. Some due process please or I call BS on this.

  22. Some due process please or I call BS on this.

    As a Putin groupie you and others here will call BS whatever evidence is produced. You will parrot Putin who will claim it has been faked. His propaganda TV channels (including RT) are already claiming that the British security services carried out this attack as a black op, and the useful fools here will be only to ready to believe whatever bilge their masters spout.

  23. I agree that PM May is likely on firm ground in making this charge. Europeans and Americans have too friendly a view of the Russians. Russia is a dysfunctional country that seeks to harm other countries. Putin is a dangerous monster and endorsed by most of the serfs in his domain.

    What good has Russia contributed to the world? Not much in over a hundred years. There has not been a Peter the Great since Peter the Great. Whereas other countries contribute life changing inventions, life saving medical products, art, education, literature, help to poorer nations: Russia produced deadly ideology, failed economic models, annexed countries, prop up dictators, and generally send criminal and unappetizing degenerates to other countries.

    It is time to see Russia for what it is and drive out its malign influence from all other countries. It will make the world a better place.

  24. on same page there NY

    The foreign secretary said the government had been talking to “friends and partners”, including his German counterpart Sigmar Gabriel and French President Emmanuel Macron.

    perhaps a reason why UK needs to be close to EU, Putin really is dangerous
    UK does’t have the might it once had, need our allies here ..

  25. Closer to the EU?

    Are you for real?

    ‘Europe couldn’t be seen for dust!’ EU ABANDONED UK to Russia threat, reveals ex-diplomat

    THE European Union will once again fail to help the UK in its fight against Russia after a former Russian spy was allegedly poisoned in Salisbury, according to former ambassador Sir Tony Brenton.
    Speaking on BBC Newsnight, the former British Ambassador to Russia claimed the UK will have to fight its battle against Russia alone as other European countries have a history of lacking support in the cause.

    Sir Tony said: “We tried at the time of Litvinenko, we were keen to get as much western supporters as we could get.

    “The Americans were in a much better state then than they are now.

    “We’re ready to be supportive. Our European partners, I regret to say, couldn’t be seen for dust.


  26. No evidence has been forthcoming only media speculation and the word of a politician. Frankly I’m calling BS on this. Produce your evidence before a coroner or a Judge. No more sexed up dossiers and illusory Weapons of Mass Distraction. Our government has been run by shameless liars before and I see no evidence that this has changed.

  27. Produce your evidence before a coroner or a Judge

    This is a naive comment.

    What would a judge be able to do in the present situation?

    How could a coroner be of value when no one has died?

  28. Dog, what on earth are you wittering on about a judge or a coroner for?

    If correct, this a matter of UK national security.

    If you believe Pootsie Putin before your own democratic Govt then that says a lot about you.

  29. I beieve nothing without evidence. Iraq weapons of mass distraction and Dr David Kelly killing himself with a butter knife are just two examples of HMG lying. You trust politicians if you like. Some of us await the proof.

  30. I beieve nothing without evidence.

    No, you just reject evidence that you don’t like. Whatever evidence the government comes up with will not be good enough for you. Because you and others hereabouts prefer to believe the words of a lying murderous corruptocrat in Moscow to the words of a democratically elected Prime Minister in London.

  31. We’ve seen no evidence. You know nothing and are just parroting the Lame Stream Media. Spoon fed with exactly what HMG wants you to think. I want an inquest with a proper coroner. There’s been a death that’s due process.

  32. Just seen Corbyn after the statement by May, he really tried to get thorough the speech without mentioning Russia, what a tosser!

  33. Dog

    You’re really speaking in slogans, based on a half baked cynicism that wouldn’t be out of place in rural Sicily.

    Coroners determine the cause of death. You want them now to start analyzing the cause of death of living people?

  34. You’re really speaking in slogans, based on a half baked cynicism that wouldn’t be out of place in rural Sicily.

    It’s a recurring theme with some around these parts Phantom.

  35. An inquest? Who died? Stephen Hawking? Jim Bowen?

    Good grief.

    Interesting that you mistrust the bumbling decency of May more than the practiced cynicism of [insert any Russian Govt spokesperson].

  36. This must have been pretty humiliating for the lying Tory :

    “On 19 February 2018 I made a seriously defamatory statement on my Twitter account, ‘Ben Bradley MP (bbradleymp)’, about Jeremy Corbyn, alleging he sold British secrets to communist spies. I have since deleted the defamatory tweet.

    I have agreed to pay an undisclosed substantial sum of money to a charity of his choice, and I will also pay his legal costs.

    “I fully accept that my statement was wholly untrue and false. I accept that I caused distress and upset to Jeremy Corbyn by my untrue and false allegations, suggesting he had betrayed his country by collaborating with foreign spies.

    “I am very sorry for publishing this untrue and false statement and I have no hesitation in offering my unreserved and unconditional apology to Jeremy Corbyn for the distress I have caused him.”

  37. Jeremy Corbyn is actually acting quite honourably.

    Once bought, he is staying bought.

  38. You seemed to delight in asking Noel and Dave to prove things on another thread.

    How about practicing what you preach?

  39. I don’t always agree with Allister Heath, but he is totally on the money with this suggestion:

    “…There are over 600 McDonald’s outlets in Russia and the country remains a dictatorial, militaristic monster. It has launched a chemical attack on British soil, forcing Theresa May to take action after years of provocations and violations of our sovereignty. Even though there are more trade, investment and personal links between our two countries than ever before, even though we can communicate freely on social media or WhatsApp, we are in a new Cold War with Russia…

    There is thus more than one kind of “capitalism”, and some varieties are deeply illiberal or even fascistic….Vladimir Putin and his kleptocratic allies, many of whom are ex-KGB or ex-FSB, have leveraged trade and commerce to build an ultra-nationalist authoritarian political model that is more sustainable than the communism of yore but just as threatening.

    This transformation is symbolised by McDonald’s itself: when it opened its first restaurant in January 1990, the queues were immense and it soon became a cult wedding venue for a public desperate to embrace Western consumer goods. Today, the chain tries to be as Russian as it can: even its signs have now been rebranded in Cyrillic alphabet, and it underplays its Americanness whenever possible. The company is an innocent bystander in all of this, of course, but it nevertheless symbolises a capitalist dream that has been perverted and captured…

    We must take the lead in building a new global military and economic alliance of like-minded countries committed to the promotion of capitalism and liberal democracy. Nato is no longer enough: it is too European, too many of its members are outright pacifists, and Turkey’s membership is problematic. The UN is ineffective and, like Nato, the product of a previous, 20th century conflict.

    The new network should be based on mutual self-interest and respectful of national sovereignty; it would be open to all liberal democracies that practice capitalism, and that respect human rights, intellectual property and privacy. It should be a “values” alliance, governed by a treaty guaranteeing military self-help and seeking the freest possible trade in goods and services. America would be a member, as would Canada, India, Israel, Australia, Japan, New Zealand, France (if it remains sufficiently distinct from the emerging European super-state) and many others.

    Such an alliance would be the biggest shift in geopolitics since the creation of the UN. It would dramatically shift the global balance of power, and allow the liberal democracies finally to fight back. It would endow the world with the sorts of robust institutions that are required to contain Russia and China and to deal with cyber-terrorism or chemical warfare…


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